Some of the OTT reaction to last night

[Remi_Moses]

People have been saying all season that playing out from the back has been costing us.

It’s cost us two in two. If it’s been costing us all season, how much? The specific goals shouldn’t be hard to name given the volume of the wailing.

The plus is that the late pressure we exert on teams is a direct result of us moving them around so much while we are in possession. This is one of the main reasons for doing it. Our second half performances back this up. Our late goals are not lucky, it’s by design. It’s a way of ensuring that more often than not you’re still in the game, even if you’re behind, because the opposition are knackered.

Statto i get worried now when we make a sub, it's normally when the opposition has a free kick. We don't appear to be settled, we make a stupid mistake and they score. Am I imagining this 

[Statto]

This I agree with.

[Derek Hardballs]

People have been saying all season that playing out from the back has been costing us.

It’s cost us two in two. If it’s been costing us all season, how much? The specific goals shouldn’t be hard to name given the volume of the wailing.

The plus is that the late pressure we exert on teams is a direct result of us moving them around so much while we are in possession. This is one of the main reasons for doing it. Our second half performances back this up. Our late goals are not lucky, it’s by design. It’s a way of ensuring that more often than not you’re still in the game, even if you’re behind, because the opposition are knackered.

But it's not just the 'direct' result it's the subsequent corner, cross, rushed pass to our own player, pressure placed on the back three / four constantly that is the problem. Also the direct result stat would be through the roof if we were at a higher level, we have got away with murder against Blues, Sheff Weds etc due to their woeful finishing. 

You play to the players at your disposals strengths not to an ideal. That is fucking stupid and whether it be DM or Pardew I will say this.  

There are NO excuses for not getting promotion with this squad and the argument we should afford any manager more time than the next two seasons to achieve this is playing with the clubs future to its detriment. 

I think some of our fans are idiotic for constantly criticising the team at games and booing etc but the master plan of tiring the opposition out is ignoring the fact we also have to chase games due to the tactic of playing out from the back.

[Banbury Baggie]

I will admit that I had a rant last night, but it's because we keep making the same errors week in week out.

How many more times will SJ play it wide, only for the wide man to be put under pressure, to then play it back to SJ, who then plays a ball down the middle of the park which is either (a) bad or (b) inaccurate which results in an opposition player gaining possession, running in on goal, shooting and scoring.

This happened against Derby, Forest, Boro, Blackburn...in other words too bloody often!

Then there are the misplaced passes, and general defensive clearances that result in the loss of possession.

Why can't we play every game like we did against Leeds. I saw fight, urgency, accurate passing, belief, speed of attack for the entire 90 minutes. The Leeds game is the only one where I would say that we played well. Some may comment on the Rotherham 4-0 away win, but by all account had their chances gone in the score line would have been very different.

We seem lethargic in our general play last night, apart from the 10-15 minute spell in the 2nd half which resulted in the equaliser. Forest had no answer during this passage of play, so why can't we maintain this tempo for longer periods of the game.

Something just doesn't seem right at West Brom at the moment.....I'm not sure what it is, but it is affecting the way we play.

[Squid]

I will admit that I had a rant last night, but it's because we keep making the same errors week in week out.

How many more times will SJ play it wide, only for the wide man to be put under pressure, to then play it back to SJ, who then plays a ball down the middle of the park which is either (a) bad or (b) inaccurate which results in an opposition player gaining possession, running in on goal, shooting and scoring.

This happened against Derby, Forest, Boro, Blackburn...in other words too bloody often!

Then there are the misplaced passes, and general defensive clearances that result in the loss of possession.

Why can't we play every game like we did against Leeds. I saw fight, urgency, accurate passing, belief, speed of attack for the entire 90 minutes. The Leeds game is the only one where I would say that we played well. Some may comment on the Rotherham 4-0 away win, but by all account had their chances gone in the score line would have been very different.

We seem lethargic in our general play last night, apart from the 10-15 minute spell in the 2nd half which resulted in the equaliser. Forest had no answer during this passage of play, so why can't we maintain this tempo for longer periods of the game.

Something just doesn't seem right at West Brom at the moment.....I'm not sure what it is, but it is affecting the way we play.

As has been said, we're missing two of our best players this season (Barnes and Phillips). We then have the Boro match where three players make stupid mistakes. It's all accumulative.

[Statto]

But it's not just the 'direct' result it's the subsequent corner, cross, rushed pass to our own player, pressure placed on the back three / four constantly that is the problem. Also the direct result stat would be through the roof if we were at a higher level, we have got away with murder against Blues, Sheff Weds etc due to their woeful finishing. 

If If If

Conceding from a corner or throw in where we have given away possession by over playing would be as a direct result IMHO, which is why I asked for real life examples.

Like the SJ bashing, when asked for specific examples people quickly fall into convenient generalisations that fit their agenda when they can't actually think of many.

Your post seems to imply that the defence wouldn't come under pressure if we played a different way, or not give the ball away in a crucial area, which is patently not true. It's the championship, people lose possession and get punished, whether playing more passes or going long ball. We conceded the winner against Boro by trying to welly it.

The constant rhetoric is that "fucking about with it at the back has been costing us all season".

For me, it is vastly overplayed (geddit?) in terms of the actual goals and games that it has cost us. The main reason to justify people's own nervousness when we keep possession in our third to work an opening.

Questioning the lack of a plan B e.g. big striker when we need it, the timing of subs etc is all legitimate, but I'll challenge this because I think it's a bollocks argument that's become ingrained into our fanbase and is now becoming a self fulfilling prophecy as the home crowd kick off every time a player dares to misplace a pass, whatever the actual outcome. The edginess is palpable and you can see it transmitting to the players.

We are right in the mix when the consensus seemed to be that we'd be lucky to finish halfway and that we would be happy with the play offs.

Now anything other than promotion is inexcusable.  Welcome to Aston Villa MkII.

[TETLEY74]

I will admit that I had a rant last night, but it's because we keep making the same errors week in week out.

How many more times will SJ play it wide, only for the wide man to be put under pressure, to then play it back to SJ, who then plays a ball down the middle of the park which is either (a) bad or (b) inaccurate which results in an opposition player gaining possession, running in on goal, shooting and scoring.

This happened against Derby, Forest, Boro, Blackburn...in other words too bloody often!

Then there are the misplaced passes, and general defensive clearances that result in the loss of possession.

Why can't we play every game like we did against Leeds.  I saw fight, urgency, accurate passing, belief, speed of attack for the entire 90 minutes.  The Leeds game is the only one where I would say that we played well.  Some may comment on the Rotherham 4-0 away win, but by all account had their chances gone in the score line would have been very different.

We seem lethargic in our general play last night, apart from the 10-15 minute spell in the 2nd half which resulted in the equaliser.  Forest had no answer during this passage of play, so why can't we maintain this tempo for longer periods of the game.

Something just doesn't seem right at West Brom at the moment.....I'm not sure what it is, but it is affecting the way we play.

I have a suspicion that the players themselves are becoming tired of the masterplan judging by some of the body language from some.

[Derek Hardballs]

But it's not just the 'direct' result it's the subsequent corner, cross, rushed pass to our own player, pressure placed on the back three / four constantly that is the problem. Also the direct result stat would be through the roof if we were at a higher level, we have got away with murder against Blues, Sheff Weds etc due to their woeful finishing. 

If If If

Conceding from a corner or throw in where we have given away possession by over playing would be as a direct result IMHO, which is why I asked for real life examples.

Like the SJ bashing, when asked for specific examples people quickly fall into convenient generalisations that fit their agenda when they can't actually think of many.

Your post seems to imply that the defence wouldn't come under pressure if we played a different way, or not give the ball away in a crucial area, which is patently not true. It's the championship, people lose possession and get punished, whether playing more passes or going long ball. We conceded the winner against Boro by trying to welly it.

The constant rhetoric is that "fucking about with it at the back has been costing us all season".

For me, it is vastly overplayed (geddit?) in terms of the actual goals and games that it has cost us. The main reason to justify people's own nervousness when we keep possession in our third to work an opening.

Questioning the lack of a plan B e.g. big striker when we need it, the timing of subs etc is all legitimate, but I'll challenge this because I think it's a bollocks argument that's become ingrained into our fanbase and is now becoming a self fulfilling prophecy as the home crowd kick off every time a player dares to misplace a pass, whatever the actual outcome. The edginess is palpable and you can see it transmitting to the players.

We are right in the mix when the consensus seemed to be that we'd be lucky to finish halfway and that we would be happy with the play offs.

Now anything other than promotion is inexcusable.  Welcome to Aston Villa MkII.

Just because people on here thought we would be midtable means diddly squat. If the next two seasons aren’t pivotal to where we will be for the next decade then I think you’re wrong.

If you don’t think that we have struggled to keep clean sheets due to over playing at the back that’s up to you, but you’re watching a different game to me. The reason it’s made into a big deal isn’t because our fans are philistines and can’t comprehend us playing that way, they get nervous because we are shite at it. That’s reason we changed system in the first place. 

Your right in general our defending isn’t great and it never will be with Jones as number, I say this due to Wigan and Everton’s defensive records whilst he assisted Martinez. The hope is that our offensive play can negate this... time will tell but it is more entertaining at least.

[Statto]

The next two seasons are pivotal, but as I've said elsewhere, the magnificent work done to turn around the shambles and malaise from 12 months ago is often ignored when we'd be nowhere near this without it.

The three at the back didn't help defensively but we scored freely. Since we switched to a four we've been as good as most in a league where there are loads of goals and the actual stats are that we have four clean sheets in our last nine league games. If we continue that to the end of the season that's decent in this league.

I agree on Jones because he promotes taking risks, but it allows us to switch play better than in previous years and get the ball into wide areas high up the pitch. This has led to a number of goals.

[Tom Joad]

But, the complaint shouldn't be about playing out from the back. It should be about ALWAYS playing out from the back. When Dawson got closed down last night he should have simply put his foot through the ball. Job done. The tactic actually does regularly help us play through sides but when it goes wrong, it goes badly wrong.  By being so stubborn at this we put ourselves on the back foot and invite pressure and the rest of the team are turned facing the ball unable to make a run.  I wish we would just mix it up a bit and not be so predictable.