Sasha Johnson, Black Lives Matter campaigner

[Cheshire East Baggie]

First of all, it appears that she has had successful surgery, although recovery from a bullet wound in the head won't be an easy thing.

BLM are deploring "an attempt to intimidate or silence her", but a close friend says "as far as I am aware this is related to rival gangs as opposed to her activism" and "she was not the intended victim".

So my question is - does that make it all right then? When did it become acceptable for knife or machete attacks and shootings between rival gangs to just happen? Shrug of the shoulders - not the intended victim, so don't worry, it isn't something more sinister. This kind of thing seems to be happening all the time, all over the country, in all communities.

[MassDebater]

Black Lives (as in America it seems) only Matter when the crime is perpetrated by a white person.

[MassDebater]

Black Lives (as in America it seems) only Matter when the crime is perpetrated by a white person.

[Spandaubaggie]

Ghetto issues are the main problem. A black kid from a united hard working family will do far better in life than some white scally on a council estate whose mum has had 6 kids off 4 different dads and lives on benefits.

Poverty and the inability of the government to intervene with education to get people out of the underclass is far and away the issue rather than skin colour.

America has issues on a completely different scale to what we have here and I hate the fact that we have turned race issues into a huge problem here when we have by and large a racially tolerant country.

[fuzzbox]

Ghetto issues are the main problem. A black kid from a united hard working family will do far better in life than some white scally on a council estate whose mum has had 6 kids off 4 different dads and lives on benefits.

Poverty and the inability of the government to intervene with education to get people out of the underclass is far and away the issue rather than skin colour.

America has issues on a completely different scale to what we have here and I hate the fact that we have turned race issues into a huge problem here when we have by and large a racially tolerant country.

Would agree with most of that. 

first paragraph - There is statistical evidence that indicates you are correct.

second paragraph - I would agree with the poverty part. 'Far and away the issue' is probably a little OTT but I would agree that generational poverty is the primary factor. Of course, that opens the debate why certain members of our community are more likely to suffer from generational poverty.

third paragraph -  In my experience of both being black and having lived in a few countries and now primarily the UK and US, I would agree that the UK is more tolerant than most and certainly more so than the USA. However, I suppose it also depends on how you define 'tolerant' and then it raises the issue of what you would consider 'acceptable'.

FWIW, I do believe social deprivation is the biggest issue. Whilst I generally support BLM, I do wonder what a white kid in a shit estate on the outskirts of Blackpool thinks. He's not getting a fair chance either - who's looking out for him? 

In conclusion, racism is part of a bigger problem. There's nothing to stop us trying to solve both at the same time. The same approach would work equally effectively with ALL underserved parts of our community.

I say help them ALL to get up and working so I have to pay less taxes and my home is less likely to get burgled!

[Kit Kat Chunky]

First of all, it appears that she has had successful surgery, although recovery from a bullet wound in the head won't be an easy thing.

BLM are deploring "an attempt to intimidate or silence her", but a close friend says "as far as I am aware this is related to rival gangs as opposed to her activism" and "she was not the intended victim".

So my question is - does that make it all right then? When did it become acceptable for knife or machete attacks and shootings between rival gangs to just happen? Shrug of the shoulders - not the intended victim, so don't worry, it isn't something more sinister. This kind of thing seems to be happening all the time, all over the country, in all communities.

Police said at this stage there was no evidence to suggest she had received any credible threats against her.

Ms Johnson had been at a party or gathering when she was injured but she did not believe "she was the intended victim.

Meanwhile BLM say "Any attempt to intimidate or silence her, is an attack on all of us.".

And this is why I have such a problem with BLM. It would appear from the Police and eye-witnesses that she was caught up in gang warfare, and was not the intended victim, yet BLM try to make out it was because of her involvement in the BLM movement. Cue more illegal protests and violence in the name of BLM.

[coxy134]

Ghetto issues are the main problem. A black kid from a united hard working family will do far better in life than some white scally on a council estate whose mum has had 6 kids off 4 different dads and lives on benefits.

Poverty and the inability of the government to intervene with education to get people out of the underclass is far and away the issue rather than skin colour.

America has issues on a completely different scale to what we have here and I hate the fact that we have turned race issues into a huge problem here when we have by and large a racially tolerant country.

Would agree with most of that. 

first paragraph - There is statistical evidence that indicates you are correct.

second paragraph - I would agree with the poverty part. 'Far and away the issue' is probably a little OTT but I would agree that generational poverty is the primary factor. Of course, that opens the debate why certain members of our community are more likely to suffer from generational poverty.

third paragraph -   In my experience of both being black and having lived in a few countries and now primarily the UK and US, I would agree that the UK is more tolerant than most and certainly more so than the USA.  However, I suppose it depends on how you define 'tolerant' and then what you would consider 'acceptable'.

FWIW, I do believe social deprivation is the biggest issue. Whilst I generally support BLM, I do wonder what a white kid in a shit estate on the outskirts of Blackpool thinks. He's not getting a fair chance either - who's looking out for him? 

I say help them ALL to get up and working so I have to pay less taxes and my home is less likely to get burgled!

Of course all what you say is correct. But I think burglary is different to whats happening here? I am not trying to demean what your saying by the way. But perhaps burglary more likely comes from poverty due to needing money etc?

But this is gang culture and the need to kill/maim rather than be fed? I see it as taking pleasure rather than seeking food. After all I know of many football hooligans and possibly gangs who have come from strict loving families?  Not sure where it comes from. I suppose when we were kids we wanted to join a gang, not often in the search for violence though or if it did it was handbags at dawn stuff. 
Is it because we have more single parent families that our youngsters want to feel part of a "family"? Is it boredom and lack of career prospects, drugs (the taking of). Certainly parenting has to be a big part of it. I am convinced television and some computer games have glamorised gangs rather than paint it badly. 
I am not convinced punishment and jail sentences etc are the way to stop it completely.

[fuzzbox]

First of all, it appears that she has had successful surgery, although recovery from a bullet wound in the head won't be an easy thing.

BLM are deploring "an attempt to intimidate or silence her", but a close friend says "as far as I am aware this is related to rival gangs as opposed to her activism" and "she was not the intended victim".

So my question is - does that make it all right then? When did it become acceptable for knife or machete attacks and shootings between rival gangs to just happen? Shrug of the shoulders - not the intended victim, so don't worry, it isn't something more sinister. This kind of thing seems to be happening all the time, all over the country, in all communities.

Police said at this stage there was no evidence to suggest she had received any credible threats against her.

Ms Johnson had been at a party or gathering when she was injured but she did not believe "she was the intended victim.

Meanwhile BLM say "Any attempt to intimidate or silence her, is an attack on all of us.".

And this is why I have such a problem with BLM. It would appear from the Police and eye-witnesses that she was caught up in gang warfare, and was not the intended victim, yet BLM try to make out it was because of her involvement in the BLM movement. Cue more illegal protests and violence in the name of BLM.

Yep, It's annoying. It's one of the things I find frustrating. It's ill-advised - it won't be black people that end racism, it will be fair-minded white people. Unfortunately, this type of thing pushes them away and gives the more racist, vocal minority additional firepower to fight against what is a just cause.

[Spandaubaggie]

First of all, it appears that she has had successful surgery, although recovery from a bullet wound in the head won't be an easy thing.

BLM are deploring "an attempt to intimidate or silence her", but a close friend says "as far as I am aware this is related to rival gangs as opposed to her activism" and "she was not the intended victim".

So my question is - does that make it all right then? When did it become acceptable for knife or machete attacks and shootings between rival gangs to just happen? Shrug of the shoulders - not the intended victim, so don't worry, it isn't something more sinister. This kind of thing seems to be happening all the time, all over the country, in all communities.

Police said at this stage there was no evidence to suggest she had received any credible threats against her.

Ms Johnson had been at a party or gathering when she was injured but she did not believe "she was the intended victim.

Meanwhile BLM say "Any attempt to intimidate or silence her, is an attack on all of us.".

And this is why I have such a problem with BLM. It would appear from the Police and eye-witnesses that she was caught up in gang warfare, and was not the intended victim, yet BLM try to make out it was because of her involvement in the BLM movement. Cue more illegal protests and violence in the name of BLM.

Yep, It's annoying. It's one of the things I find frustrating. It's ill-advised - it won't be black people that end racism, it will be fair-minded white people. Unfortunately, this type of thing pushes them away and gives the more racist, vocal minority additional firepower to fight against what is a just cause.

I'm delighted to hear your views Fuzzbox. I'm a middle aged, middle class white guy who is infuriated with the race debates we are having when I recall what things were like in the 80s and 90s and I had to defend an Asian mate who was going to get a kicking just for his skin colour.

I don't think, I genuinely don't, that most people care about skin colour in the UK in this day and age. I'm from an Irish family and seen cousins marry into Afro Caribbean and Iranian families. No one gives a damn in my family of the skin issue.

Culture is a different thing though. A culture of poor morals most people despise. I can't stomach black gangs and their violence, but I can't stomach white underclass scroungers either. It's not about skin, it's about values and being a decent citizen.

[DJPunkRoc]

I'm seeing a lot of speculation as to who shot her. Until I know who shot her and why, I'm remaining agnostic about blaming either BLM, racists or gangs for what happened or what happens next.