Burnham

[Derek Hardballs]

PIP is not an in or out of work benefit it’s there to help people live a decent life and recognises the extra costs many disabilities and illness’s bring with it. So extra costs for electricity to use hoists, heating, access to getting places such as work, hospital appointments etc.

I mean if that’s the people you want to give a good economic kicking too and blame for the problems the country is in… go for it. It’s a bit actually very cunty but if it makes centrist dads and right of centre people feel better they are all committing fraud. Now doesn’t that feel better, you can puff your chests out and say how grown up you are.

[tHEgLASSdOORS]

PIP is not an in or out of work benefit it’s there to help people live a decent life and recognises the extra costs many disabilities and illness’s bring with it. So extra costs for electricity to use hoists, heating, access to getting places such as work, hospital appointments etc.

I mean if that’s the people you want to give a good economic kicking too and blame for the problems the country is in… go for it. It’s a bit actually very cunty but if it makes centrist dads and right of centre people feel better they are all committing fraud. Now doesn’t that feel better, you can puff your chests out and say how grown up you are.

It was just an answer to your question Derek.

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You can earn £40k and earn more in benefit? Really? Where is the evidence for this?

You do appreciate that this type of dependency was by design don't you? Gordon Brown has a great deal to answer for.

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Increasingly I think you have a point here, or at least an opinion  that needs to be explored.

Certainly Govts have been increasingly addicted to more and more spending, achieving less and less. Even Govts who publicly stated that they were in favour of less Govt spending, have increased it.

I doubt I would agree with Proth on why this has happened, who benefits and what needs to be done next.

But he is right to raise this as an issue.

Thanks Shabbs. Those who've benefitted the most were those who already had the most, I doubt you'd disagree.

I also agree although I differ to Proth on what Browns intentions were, I agree with the consequences. It is virtually impossible to take something from the British public once you’ve established it. If I were Labour id have scrapped the triple lock and shifted all inflation related rises of other benefits to 2% flat for 5 years

[Derek Hardballs]

PIP is not an in or out of work benefit it’s there to help people live a decent life and recognises the extra costs many disabilities and illness’s bring with it. So extra costs for electricity to use hoists, heating, access to getting places such as work, hospital appointments etc.

I mean if that’s the people you want to give a good economic kicking too and blame for the problems the country is in… go for it. It’s a bit actually very cunty but if it makes centrist dads and right of centre people feel better they are all committing fraud. Now doesn’t that feel better, you can puff your chests out and say how grown up you are.

It was just an answer to your question Derek.

---

You can earn £40k and earn more in benefit? Really? Where is the evidence for this?

You do appreciate that this type of dependency was by design don't you? Gordon Brown has a great deal to answer for.

---

Increasingly I think you have a point here, or at least an opinion  that needs to be explored.

Certainly Govts have been increasingly addicted to more and more spending, achieving less and less. Even Govts who publicly stated that they were in favour of less Govt spending, have increased it.

I doubt I would agree with Proth on why this has happened, who benefits and what needs to be done next.

But he is right to raise this as an issue.

Thanks Shabbs. Those who've benefitted the most were those who already had the most, I doubt you'd disagree.

I also agree although I differ to Proth on what Browns intentions were, I agree with the consequences. It is virtually impossible to take something from the British public once you’ve established it. If I were Labour id have scrapped the triple lock and shifted all inflation related rises of other benefits to 2% flat for 5 years

Mine was just an answer to the narrative on here that the disabled are in some way to blame or the best/easiest people to take money off when looking to fix the problems they didn’t create. 

Fraudsters, most of them I’ve heard!

[baggy1]

I always felt is was naive putting a house building target that included year 1 figures as the changes required would take time to bed in, but that is done and there has to be some movement soon otherwise that is a real failed headline policy.

And the benefits issue is massive - fuck knows what can be done about that as has been shown with the attempts so far. Part of that is down to an ageing population and it's a shame they didn't break that down to pensioners and non-pensioners to give a bit more insight. But to have a country where you can earn £40k and get more in benefit than you pay in tax is just wrong (although I will caveat with it would be interesting to get some detail behind that)

You can earn £40k and earn more in benefit? Really? Where is the evidence for this?

Oh and I haven’t said anything about where Labour are in the polls for weeks… you’re getting confused again

In the report that MICS linked - If you’re going to give a cocky shit answer it would be worth you checking the thread 1st I reckon.

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PIP is not an in or out of work benefit it’s there to help people live a decent life and recognises the extra costs many disabilities and illness’s bring with it. So extra costs for electricity to use hoists, heating, access to getting places such as work, hospital appointments etc.

I mean if that’s the people you want to give a good economic kicking too and blame for the problems the country is in… go for it. It’s a bit actually very cunty but if it makes centrist dads and right of centre people feel better they are all committing fraud. Now doesn’t that feel better, you can puff your chests out and say how grown up you are.

And then you double down on your cockiness with this. It was simply a comment ion a linked report that surprised me.

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PIP is not an in or out of work benefit it’s there to help people live a decent life and recognises the extra costs many disabilities and illness’s bring with it. So extra costs for electricity to use hoists, heating, access to getting places such as work, hospital appointments etc.

I mean if that’s the people you want to give a good economic kicking too and blame for the problems the country is in… go for it. It’s a bit actually very cunty but if it makes centrist dads and right of centre people feel better they are all committing fraud. Now doesn’t that feel better, you can puff your chests out and say how grown up you are.

It was just an answer to your question Derek.

---

You can earn £40k and earn more in benefit? Really? Where is the evidence for this?

You do appreciate that this type of dependency was by design don't you? Gordon Brown has a great deal to answer for.

---

Increasingly I think you have a point here, or at least an opinion  that needs to be explored.

Certainly Govts have been increasingly addicted to more and more spending, achieving less and less. Even Govts who publicly stated that they were in favour of less Govt spending, have increased it.

I doubt I would agree with Proth on why this has happened, who benefits and what needs to be done next.

But he is right to raise this as an issue.

Thanks Shabbs. Those who've benefitted the most were those who already had the most, I doubt you'd disagree.

I also agree although I differ to Proth on what Browns intentions were, I agree with the consequences. It is virtually impossible to take something from the British public once you’ve established it. If I were Labour id have scrapped the triple lock and shifted all inflation related rises of other benefits to 2% flat for 5 years

Mine was just an answer to the narrative on here that the disabled are in some way to blame or the best/easiest people to take money off when looking to fix the problems they didn’t create. 

Fraudsters, most of them I’ve heard!

Nobody suggested, or has suggested, that the disabled are fraudsters, but you believing that everyone who claims benefit is disabled then you are as naive as you make out. I was in the doctors this morning and two blokes were in front of me, one didn’t speak English so the other was asking for an ‘exemption from work’ for him because he had diabetes apparently. But there is no fraud apparently.

[CarlosCorbewrong]

Are you a doctor B1? Extensive understanding of how diabetes is affecting this forrin man? What does his language have to do with his disability?

[baggy1]

You’re right CC, I’m not a Doctor, but the receptionist had to explain that he needed to get a Doctor’s sign off before he can get the exemption.

[CarlosCorbewrong]

Seems like Streeting is having the dark forces combine to stifle any ambition he has/had:

1. Treasury refuses to back his policy move to cut ICB and NHS England staff.
2. No funding for the "10 year plan" which cost £3m just to write.
3. Rumoured not to have a speech in the main hall at Conference.

Whether it stifles or accelerates a leadership bid, is as yet unknown.

[Derek Hardballs]

Seems like Streeting is having the dark forces combine to stifle any ambition he has/had:

1.  Treasury refuses to back his policy move to cut ICB and NHS England staff.
2.  No funding for the "10 year plan" which cost £3m just to write.
3.  Rumoured not to have a speech in the main hall at Conference.

Whether it stifles or accelerates a leadership bid, is as yet unknown.

I think we all want to see more of Kier and Reeves don’t we?

[Protheroe]

Mine was just an answer to the narrative on here that the disabled are in some way to blame or the best/easiest people to take money off when looking to fix the problems they didn’t create. 

You're the only one who ever frames it like that.

The fact remains that the growth in long term sick / disabled claimants is unparalleled anywhere else in the world. Don't you think that's odd?

[CarlosCorbewrong]

We have to be the best at something...