Nissan

[baggy1]

What "huge investment" are you on about? No new frameworks have been announced, no new models have been announced, no new investment has been announced. All they've done is consolidate the Nissan and Renault frameworks into one factory to cut costs in one factory and not invest in another.

This new investment: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57640001

ahem 

The government is contributing to the overall cost of the project, which is expected to cost hundreds of millions.

The size of the government contribution has not been disclosed.

[Borin' Baggie]

What "huge investment" are you on about? No new frameworks have been announced, no new models have been announced, no new investment has been announced. All they've done is consolidate the Nissan and Renault frameworks into one factory to cut costs in one factory and not invest in another.

This new investment: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57640001

1. This has nothing to do with the context of that statement which, need I remind you, was about new assembly lines and not to do with meeting ROO compliance to sell into the EU.

2. This has been known for ages, the FT reported on it last month and the contingent factor was the government paying for it. They're doing the same down in Baginton for JLR (but that's because it's a last resort for JLR for reasons I'm not allowed to disclose).

[Protheroe]

Both developments are precisely the opposite of what was projected by Remain.

I doubt there's a gigafactory in Europe being built without some element of subsidy.

[baggy1]

Both developments are precisely the opposite of what was projected by Remain.

I doubt there's a gigafactory in Europe being built without some element of subsidy.

So basically you are saying that we didn't have to leave to do this. This would have happened anyway.

[Protheroe]

So basically you are saying that we didn't have to leave to do this. This would have happened anyway.

No, I'm saying that we can have our cake and eat it. As will become increasingly obvious when we join the CPTPP.

[baggy1]

I have some magic beans for you if you're interested.

[Borin' Baggie]

Both developments are precisely the opposite of what was projected by Remain.

I doubt there's a gigafactory in Europe being built without some element of subsidy.

Both developments would have also not been viable if not for the agreement on ROO for manufactured parts, something you opposed as it gives EU oversight over UK manufacturing.

And I believe the Envision AESC facility being built in France for Renault (and is to be higher capacity) is being funded externally to the French government. Though it has had previous EU funding, then again so has the batter facility at Sunderland when the Leaf was first earmarked for production there.

As for Baginton, I can assure you it's of a last resort and the government are essentially bailing out JLR for their incompetence.

---

So basically you are saying that we didn't have to leave to do this. This would have happened anyway.

No, I'm saying that we can have our cake and eat it. As will become increasingly obvious when we join the CPTPP.

We have bilateral arrangements with all but 2 TPP members, those two are the ones who have not ratified it yet. So I really don't see the point of joining the TPP over the EEA.

[Protheroe]

We have bilateral arrangements with all but 2 TPP members, those two are the ones who have not ratified it yet. So I really don't see the point of joining the TPP over the EEA.

I don't recall making the comparision.

In any event it rather depends on what the constituent countries of the TPP are in the future.

---

I have some magic beans for you if you're interested.

I've already used them to alleviate the immediate Emergency Budget, the immediate 500,000 job losses, the £4300 cost to every household of the year long recession that would follow a Brexit vote, World War Three, the immediate destruction of our manufacturing base, the wholesale relocation of the financial services industry and several other bits of hyperbolic bullshit we were fed before and after the EU Referendum.

I'll give you a call for some magic beans when I find the empty produce shelves that #FBPE types tend to post on Twitter, but are - at least for now - completely invisible to the rest of us.

[baggy1]

We have bilateral arrangements with all but 2 TPP members, those two are the ones who have not ratified it yet. So I really don't see the point of joining the TPP over the EEA.

I don't recall making the comparision.

In any event it rather depends on what the constituent countries of the TPP are in the future.

---

I have some magic beans for you if you're interested.

I've already used them to alleviate the immediate Emergency Budget, the immediate 500,000 job losses, the £4300 cost to every household of the year long recession that would follow a Brexit vote, World War Three, the immediate destruction of our manufacturing base, the wholesale relocation of the financial services industry and several other bits of hyperbolic bullshit we were fed before and after the EU Referendum.

I'll give you a call for some magic beans when I find the empty produce shelves that #FBPE types tend to post on Twitter, but are - at least for now - completely invisible to the rest of us.

So your basic answer is that it's not as bad as some extremes said it would be but appear to be hamstrung when it comes to admitting that we are, at best, the same as we were (and in areas worse off) making it all a big fucking waste of time to nearly get back to where we were.

[Borin' Baggie]

We have bilateral arrangements with all but 2 TPP members, those two are the ones who have not ratified it yet. So I really don't see the point of joining the TPP over the EEA.

I don't recall making the comparision.

In any event it rather depends on what the constituent countries of the TPP are in the future.

You can't be in both the EEA and TPP, it's one or the other. And joining the EEA and EFTA vastly outweighs joining the TPP in terms of goods and services even when bilateral agreements with the TPP signatories are factored in. Otherwise we might as well join the bloody African Union.

And which countries are you referring to? Indonesia who we're shadowing the EU negotiations for a bilateral agreement? The ACP nations that we have rolled over the EU trade agreement with? Or the US, who if they re-join the agreement unilaterally dictates terms on trade with their own domestic legislation and arbitration over the whole agreement which is much worse than the ECJ from a "sovereignty" point of view?

---

I'll give you a call for some magic beans when I find the empty produce shelves.

Do you live on a different planet or something? My choice of fresh fruit the past week has been green bananas, green bananas, green bananas. There has been shortage of fresh produce and a decrease in quality of said fresh produce over the last 6 months and it's going to get worse as the UK has had a terrible harvest due to poor weather and there being red tape and delays on deliveries on produce coming from North Africa via Europe and Southern Europe. As someone who has cut out meat significantly in their diet I am really pissed off as my shopping bills are higher (15% up on this time last year) and all this talk is about cheaper fucking beef. And this has been a case at the Waitrose and Sainsbury's in town and the Aldi and Sainsbury's in Canley.