Keef

[Squid]

I’m not and never will be a socialist, but if you think Labour chasing Reform and Conservative voters will see them win the next election… you are Morgan McSweeney and I claim my £200.

You do nothing but post Corbyn 15-19 policies on here and most folks said he was a communist.

I haven’t posted any policies. Let the Corbyn obsession go, it’s over.

It's not an obsession it's just pointing out your nonsense. 

Almost everything you say this Labour government should be doing, the Labour party 15-19 campaigned on. Whether you explicitly post policy or not if you can't see the connection and the obvious contradiction then it's a pointless discussion and just confirms you're happiest in your role of professional complainer.

Ted just take a look at who the Labour Party have just elected as Deputy Leader and what she has been saying for the last few months, it aligns with what I’ve been saying for over a year. The only people out of touch with genuine Labour Party members is those who are continuing to think Blue Labour are the answer and what people want.


Corbyn was and always will be unelectable thanks to the baggage he and momentum brought to the party, that doesn’t mean the party had to lurch to the right to the extent it alienates thousands of its core voters and is pretty much indistinguishable currently from Sunak’s led Conservative Party. When people said they wanted change they didn’t just mean the fucking badge.

Not just Corbyn, Ed Miliband was soundly beaten in 2015 too. Starmer's job isn't in danger because he's too right wing. It's because he's seen as indecisive and and has the political instincts of a squashed hedgehog.

[Derek Hardballs]

You do nothing but post Corbyn 15-19 policies on here and most folks said he was a communist.

I haven’t posted any policies. Let the Corbyn obsession go, it’s over.

It's not an obsession it's just pointing out your nonsense. 

Almost everything you say this Labour government should be doing, the Labour party 15-19 campaigned on. Whether you explicitly post policy or not if you can't see the connection and the obvious contradiction then it's a pointless discussion and just confirms you're happiest in your role of professional complainer.

Ted just take a look at who the Labour Party have just elected as Deputy Leader and what she has been saying for the last few months, it aligns with what I’ve been saying for over a year. The only people out of touch with genuine Labour Party members is those who are continuing to think Blue Labour are the answer and what people want.


Corbyn was and always will be unelectable thanks to the baggage he and momentum brought to the party, that doesn’t mean the party had to lurch to the right to the extent it alienates thousands of its core voters and is pretty much indistinguishable currently from Sunak’s led Conservative Party. When people said they wanted change they didn’t just mean the fucking badge.

Not just Corbyn, Ed Miliband was soundly beaten in 2015 too. Starmer's job isn't in danger because he's too right wing. It's because he's seen as indecisive and and has the political instincts of a squashed hedgehog.

More than half the Labour Party membership disagrees, which is why Lucy Powell is now the Deputy Leader and thousands have left to join other party’s. This is about his poor political instincts, which are spectacularly poor, aptly shown by him trying to win over Reform and Conservative voters whilst ignoring and taking for granted the votes of those left of centre. 

Currently he’s tanking in the polls and that’s really not just because of ‘optics’.

[Squid]

I haven’t posted any policies. Let the Corbyn obsession go, it’s over.

It's not an obsession it's just pointing out your nonsense. 

Almost everything you say this Labour government should be doing, the Labour party 15-19 campaigned on. Whether you explicitly post policy or not if you can't see the connection and the obvious contradiction then it's a pointless discussion and just confirms you're happiest in your role of professional complainer.

Ted just take a look at who the Labour Party have just elected as Deputy Leader and what she has been saying for the last few months, it aligns with what I’ve been saying for over a year. The only people out of touch with genuine Labour Party members is those who are continuing to think Blue Labour are the answer and what people want.


Corbyn was and always will be unelectable thanks to the baggage he and momentum brought to the party, that doesn’t mean the party had to lurch to the right to the extent it alienates thousands of its core voters and is pretty much indistinguishable currently from Sunak’s led Conservative Party. When people said they wanted change they didn’t just mean the fucking badge.

Not just Corbyn, Ed Miliband was soundly beaten in 2015 too. Starmer's job isn't in danger because he's too right wing. It's because he's seen as indecisive and and has the political instincts of a squashed hedgehog.

More than half the Labour Party membership disagrees, which is why Lucy Powell is now the Deputy Leader and thousands have left to join other party’s. This is about his poor political instincts, which are spectacularly poor, aptly shown by him trying to win over Reform and Conservative voters whilst ignoring and taking for granted the votes of those left of centre. 

Currently he’s tanking in the polls and that’s really not just because of ‘optics’.

Do the Labour Party membership win elections now? Because they didn't in 15 - 19, as has been pointed out several times.

Also, look at the voting results:
.
"Powell took 87,407 votes, nearly 14,000 votes ahead of Phillipson, on a turnout of 16.6%." - BBC News. Compare that to Rayner who got 228,944 (52.6% turnout). It's not really indicating a groundswell of support for the Left wing of Labour.

Starmer is indeed tanking in the polls, but there is nothing whatsoever to indicate that a move leftwards would increase his polling, when he's already being criticised for being weak and indecisive.

[Derek Hardballs]

It's not an obsession it's just pointing out your nonsense. 

Almost everything you say this Labour government should be doing, the Labour party 15-19 campaigned on. Whether you explicitly post policy or not if you can't see the connection and the obvious contradiction then it's a pointless discussion and just confirms you're happiest in your role of professional complainer.

Ted just take a look at who the Labour Party have just elected as Deputy Leader and what she has been saying for the last few months, it aligns with what I’ve been saying for over a year. The only people out of touch with genuine Labour Party members is those who are continuing to think Blue Labour are the answer and what people want.


Corbyn was and always will be unelectable thanks to the baggage he and momentum brought to the party, that doesn’t mean the party had to lurch to the right to the extent it alienates thousands of its core voters and is pretty much indistinguishable currently from Sunak’s led Conservative Party. When people said they wanted change they didn’t just mean the fucking badge.

Not just Corbyn, Ed Miliband was soundly beaten in 2015 too. Starmer's job isn't in danger because he's too right wing. It's because he's seen as indecisive and and has the political instincts of a squashed hedgehog.

More than half the Labour Party membership disagrees, which is why Lucy Powell is now the Deputy Leader and thousands have left to join other party’s. This is about his poor political instincts, which are spectacularly poor, aptly shown by him trying to win over Reform and Conservative voters whilst ignoring and taking for granted the votes of those left of centre. 

Currently he’s tanking in the polls and that’s really not just because of ‘optics’.

Do the Labour Party membership win elections now? Because they didn't in 15 - 19, as has been pointed out several times.

Also, look at the voting results:
.
"Powell took 87,407 votes, nearly 14,000 votes ahead of Phillipson, on a turnout of 16.6%." - BBC News. Compare that to Rayner who got 228,944 (52.6% turnout). It's not really indicating a groundswell of support for the Left wing of Labour.

Starmer is indeed tanking in the polls, but there is nothing whatsoever to indicate that a move leftwards would increase his polling, when he's already being criticised for being weak and indecisive.

There is even weaker support for the Blue Labour side of the party amongst its members by that logic. Squid if you think trying to woo Reform and Tory voters at the expense of its core vote is the answer then carry on with Starmer and co and see where it leaves the party at the next election. The only way it’ll cling to power is buddying up with the Greens and or Lib Dem’s. 

There is zero evidence that if Labour move even further right, which your post implies they need to do win, that it will work. It’ll just mean Labour stand for absolutely naff all which is what they are already in danger of. Then the question will be what’s the point if Labour?

[Squid]

Ted just take a look at who the Labour Party have just elected as Deputy Leader and what she has been saying for the last few months, it aligns with what I’ve been saying for over a year. The only people out of touch with genuine Labour Party members is those who are continuing to think Blue Labour are the answer and what people want.


Corbyn was and always will be unelectable thanks to the baggage he and momentum brought to the party, that doesn’t mean the party had to lurch to the right to the extent it alienates thousands of its core voters and is pretty much indistinguishable currently from Sunak’s led Conservative Party. When people said they wanted change they didn’t just mean the fucking badge.

Not just Corbyn, Ed Miliband was soundly beaten in 2015 too. Starmer's job isn't in danger because he's too right wing. It's because he's seen as indecisive and and has the political instincts of a squashed hedgehog.

More than half the Labour Party membership disagrees, which is why Lucy Powell is now the Deputy Leader and thousands have left to join other party’s. This is about his poor political instincts, which are spectacularly poor, aptly shown by him trying to win over Reform and Conservative voters whilst ignoring and taking for granted the votes of those left of centre. 

Currently he’s tanking in the polls and that’s really not just because of ‘optics’.

Do the Labour Party membership win elections now? Because they didn't in 15 - 19, as has been pointed out several times.

Also, look at the voting results:
.
"Powell took 87,407 votes, nearly 14,000 votes ahead of Phillipson, on a turnout of 16.6%." - BBC News. Compare that to Rayner who got 228,944 (52.6% turnout). It's not really indicating a groundswell of support for the Left wing of Labour.

Starmer is indeed tanking in the polls, but there is nothing whatsoever to indicate that a move leftwards would increase his polling, when he's already being criticised for being weak and indecisive.

There is even weaker support for the Blue Labour side of the party amongst its members by that logic. Squid if you think trying to woo Reform and Tory voters at the expense of its core vote is the answer then carry on with Starmer and co and see where it leaves the party at the next election. The only way it’ll cling to power is buddying up with the Greens and or Lib Dem’s. 

There is zero evidence that if Labour move even further right, which your post implies they need to do win, that it will work. It’ll just mean Labour stand for absolutely naff all which is what they are already in danger of. Then the question will be what’s the point if Labour?

What is Labour's core vote though? That's the key question, not what Labour Party members think. 

As has been pointed out, that core vote was insufficient to win elections in 2015, 2017 and 2019. Starmer won in 2024, mainly because people were sick of the Tories and their infighting and incompetence. 

Yes, the Green Party are enjoying something of a resurgence, but that is ultimately meaningless in a FPTP system. As far as electorial politics go, we appear to be living in a post-Left society. That doesn't give me any great joy, but it appears to be the reality. So now what? Just pretend otherwise and act as though people will suddenly want a high tax, high spend government?

[Tom Joad 25]

You know that saying in football, I'd rather have a lucky manager than a good manager? Starmer appears the exact opposite of both.He seems to have a natural instinct to back the wrong horse. The 1st person deported under his 1 in-1 out idea promptly gets a boat back and a few days later a high profile prisoner is released in error. This was exactly what he doesn't need. If you add to this his apparent unwillingness to put forward unpopular policies and his wishy/washy speeches, instead of taking flak he should go on all out attack. The country is floundering after years of under-investment and incompetence.  He should make a powerful speech in a statesman like manner ensuring every single voter understands this. And done with modern coaching like Thatcher used when she wobbled. Or like Churchill's "I have nothing to offer but blood, toil etc". Make people aware, give them hope however distant it may be.All of these tactics (and political decisions of course), are there to be used. More "This is what needs to happen" less "We're trying hard but it's not easy y'know". He should man up or.... we face the unthinkable.

[man in the corner shop]

Fine points Tom.
My impression of Starmer is that he simply has no backbone and is a nodding dog to McSweeney and the bald scots dingle fella.
Badly advised, no independence of thought,not a strategic bone in his body. Oh, and simply not very good at politics.

He is toast. He may as well go now as after Xmas. The problem for Labour is the lack of talent in the zombie PLP. I cant think of anyone who can turn it around in terms of leadership and policy. The answer is certainly not Wes fucking Streeting. Though that would please Proth. Which says it all.

[Pipkins]

This is down to them being career politicians rather than those whom genuinely want life to improve for the many

Reading that link it goes on about all those poor councillors losing their seats. Fuck em what about the residents they supposed to represent ?

Where are the Tony Benn Frank Field Betty Bothroyd Dennis Skinner & all?

Instead we have the likes of Emmaa Reynolds, kicked out in W'ton & now MP for somewhere down south

[Middlemore rd]

This is down to them being career politicians rather than those whom genuinely want life to improve for the many

Reading that link it goes on about all those poor councillors losing their seats. Fuck em what about the residents they supposed to represent ?

Where are the Tony Benn Frank Field Betty Bothroyd  Skinner Dennis& all?

[quote pid="814480" dateline="1761492423"]

Instead we have the likes of Emmaa Reynolds, kicked out in W'ton & now MP for somewhere down south
[/quote]

I think they are all dead .

[CarlosCorbewrong]

Too soon.