Back to the Office

[FenlandBoing]

Work from home if you can, the second wave is coming! Get your Xmas shopping done in September if you can while shops are quiet and open!

[chasetownbaggie]

I work on IT projects that are usually based on a client site. Unusually, I've worked for the same client for 20 years now. I used to travel 75 miles to their site every day (spending 2 nights in a hotel to break the week up) but after my second son was born 12 years ago, I managed to convince the client that I didn't need to be in the office every day to the point that I've been WFH for over 5 years now.

Like everything, it's got it's pros and cons but on balance I'm pleased with my working arrangement. I don't miss the travelling one iota but I do often feel "out of sight, out of mind" which does cause me to have the occasional day where I feel quite low and i do miss face to face interaction.

Is WFH the future? Probably, but it's definitely not for everyone.

Anyway, since fewer of us will be commuting to work from now, any chance of ending HS2 and spending the money on something of benefit to us all?

[baggy1]

Really? I'm not a fan of summary planning consent to convert offices to residential. It's a bad policy.

And what do you propose to do with the empty buildings then? Take a trip up Trindle Road or the bypass in Dudley and look at the benefits brought to he area from leaving Cavendish house empty.

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I work on IT projects that are usually based on a client site. Unusually, I've worked for the same client for 20 years now. I used to travel 75 miles to their site every day (spending 2 nights in a hotel to break the week up) but after my second son was born 12 years ago, I managed to convince the client that I didn't need to be in the office every day to the point that I've been WFH for over 5 years now.

Like everything, it's got it's pros and cons but on balance I'm pleased with my working arrangement. I don't miss the travelling one iota but I do often feel "out of sight, out of mind" which does cause me to have the occasional day where I feel quite low and i do miss face to face interaction.

Is WFH the future? Probably, but it's definitely not for everyone.

Anyway, since fewer of us will be commuting to work from now, any chance of ending HS2 and spending the money on something of benefit to us all?

HS2 is already underway chase, the contracts in place would cost the government a fortune to cancel now. It's happening even if they only complete the 1st phase to Birmingham.

[Jack Halford]

The whole situation has accelerated an inevitable situation whereby, over time, retail would move gradually to more and more online and working from home became the norm. I work for a multi-national organisation and, as far as I'm aware, only the China office has reopened. We are definitely not going back before 1st October and even then we will be phased back in, as one of the older ones who isn't part of a large team I can't see me going back this year.

My boss has already asked to see when our lease runs out and if we have a break clause, I would imagine that has occurred across all businesses that rent in the country. Now is not the time to be investing in commercial property companies. The other big point made by our CEO the other day was how much he was enjoying not travelling because of the extra time he has with his family, don't expect that to change much in the short term.

It also highlights the way the government works in that it reacts to unexpected outcomes to their own reactive measures. They've looked up and realised that all of the businesses that relied on offices being full are now likely to go out of business - a sort of capitalist ponzi scheme. Instead of building a plan for those businesses and commercial space they have gone with the 'please go back to the office' approach. No business is going to send employees back in until it is guaranteed to be safe - can you imagine the 1st person that catches covid and dies after being forced back into the office and the subsequent law suit for corporate manslaughter?

Unfortunately nobody is keen to break ranks because the government have lied, and covered up their mess throughout this pandemic and are at a stage where they simply don't believe them.

Offices of the future will be smaller and hardly ever will we have a situation where we all go back together. There will be some hub facilities that can use their space as a meeting / conference type space for all employees to have get togethers but apart from that I can't see any major change soon. Let's hope someone sees this as an opportunity to redefine commercial space into residential.

There are lots of businesses looking at office space reductions at the moment.

What few people are saying though is that this will have a huge knock on effect to the value of many pensions.

Many of the big pension schemes own huge office portfolios as offices were always seen as a good bet and in the main gave a healthy yield.

Also, most offices really don’t lend themselves to a conversion to residential. There have been some really poor office to resi conversions in Brum City Centre.

Also lots of younger employees won’t gain half the experience they would have had working in an office.

[baggy1]

The whole situation has accelerated an inevitable situation whereby, over time, retail would move gradually to more and more online and working from home became the norm. I work for a multi-national organisation and, as far as I'm aware, only the China office has reopened. We are definitely not going back before 1st October and even then we will be phased back in, as one of the older ones who isn't part of a large team I can't see me going back this year.

My boss has already asked to see when our lease runs out and if we have a break clause, I would imagine that has occurred across all businesses that rent in the country. Now is not the time to be investing in commercial property companies. The other big point made by our CEO the other day was how much he was enjoying not travelling because of the extra time he has with his family, don't expect that to change much in the short term.

It also highlights the way the government works in that it reacts to unexpected outcomes to their own reactive measures. They've looked up and realised that all of the businesses that relied on offices being full are now likely to go out of business - a sort of capitalist ponzi scheme. Instead of building a plan for those businesses and commercial space they have gone with the 'please go back to the office' approach. No business is going to send employees back in until it is guaranteed to be safe - can you imagine the 1st person that catches covid and dies after being forced back into the office and the subsequent law suit for corporate manslaughter?

Unfortunately nobody is keen to break ranks because the government have lied, and covered up their mess throughout this pandemic and are at a stage where they simply don't believe them.

Offices of the future will be smaller and hardly ever will we have a situation where we all go back together. There will be some hub facilities that can use their space as a meeting / conference type space for all employees to have get togethers but apart from that I can't see any major change soon. Let's hope someone sees this as an opportunity to redefine commercial space into residential.

There are lots of businesses looking at office space reductions at the moment.

What few people are saying though is that this will have a huge knock on effect to the value of many pensions.

Many of the big pension schemes own huge office portfolios as offices were always seen as a good bet and in the main gave a healthy yield.

Also, most offices really don’t lend themselves to a conversion to residential. There have been some really poor office to resi conversions in Brum City Centre.

Also lots of younger employees won’t gain half the experience they would have had working in an office.

So what are you proposing, just continue as it is and businesses just pay for something they don’t need to use so that we that we keep pensions afloat - that seems like a ponzi scheme to me.

Agree on the kids not gaining the experience but we will have some form of office use, just not at the level we have now.

[Jack Halford]

The whole situation has accelerated an inevitable situation whereby, over time, retail would move gradually to more and more online and working from home became the norm. I work for a multi-national organisation and, as far as I'm aware, only the China office has reopened. We are definitely not going back before 1st October and even then we will be phased back in, as one of the older ones who isn't part of a large team I can't see me going back this year.

My boss has already asked to see when our lease runs out and if we have a break clause, I would imagine that has occurred across all businesses that rent in the country. Now is not the time to be investing in commercial property companies. The other big point made by our CEO the other day was how much he was enjoying not travelling because of the extra time he has with his family, don't expect that to change much in the short term.

It also highlights the way the government works in that it reacts to unexpected outcomes to their own reactive measures. They've looked up and realised that all of the businesses that relied on offices being full are now likely to go out of business - a sort of capitalist ponzi scheme. Instead of building a plan for those businesses and commercial space they have gone with the 'please go back to the office' approach. No business is going to send employees back in until it is guaranteed to be safe - can you imagine the 1st person that catches covid and dies after being forced back into the office and the subsequent law suit for corporate manslaughter?

Unfortunately nobody is keen to break ranks because the government have lied, and covered up their mess throughout this pandemic and are at a stage where they simply don't believe them.

Offices of the future will be smaller and hardly ever will we have a situation where we all go back together. There will be some hub facilities that can use their space as a meeting / conference type space for all employees to have get togethers but apart from that I can't see any major change soon. Let's hope someone sees this as an opportunity to redefine commercial space into residential.

There are lots of businesses looking at office space reductions at the moment.

What few people are saying though is that this will have a huge knock on effect to the value of many pensions.

Many of the big pension schemes own huge office portfolios as offices were always seen as a good bet and in the main gave a healthy yield.

Also, most offices really don’t lend themselves to a conversion to residential. There have been some really poor office to resi conversions in Brum City Centre.

Also lots of younger employees won’t gain half the experience they would have had working in an office.

So what are you proposing, just continue as it is and businesses just pay for something they don’t need to use so that we that we keep pensions afloat - that seems like a ponzi scheme to me.

Agree on the kids not gaining the experience but we will have some form of office use, just not at the level we have now.

No what I’m saying is that people may have a different view if the realised what impact it will have on their pensions, which it will.

[baggy1]

The problem with that is you are not dealing with individuals making the decisions, especially with big office space usage, it will be corporations. When they see the savings running into hundreds of thousands a year which will go straight back on the bottom line and into shareholders pockets, what do you think they’ll do?

[Jack Halford]

The problem with that is you are not dealing with individuals making the decisions, especially with big office space usage, it will be corporations. When they see the savings running into hundreds of thousands a year which will go straight back on the bottom line and into shareholders pockets, what do you think they’ll do?

No, I agree with what you are saying about the corporations. I was looking at it from those individuals who still want to work from home.

The next stage for the corporations will be to outsource where they can abroad or freeze or reduce pay to take account of the salary weighting for travelling.

Councils losing out on reduced business rates will look to increase council tax for those working from home. Insurers will then look to increase household insurance if you work from home.

[Protheroe]

Baggy1 - Cavendish House would have been an appalling residential conversion. I looked at it with GE Capital back in 2006. Most 1960's office blocks don't lend themselves easily to conversion as the ceiling heights are too low, the services are concentrated often in a single core, the natural light is compromised, many of the buildings thrown up in the late sixties boom are of poor quality construction, crap parking ratios and appalling acoustics. One great exception is the current conversion of the Swan Office Centre at Yardley which looks as though it will be magnificent.

Jack Halford - The London office market is going to take a nosedive. But there are corresponding investment opportunities in big shed funds and regional offices. The much maligned edge of town business park is about to have a renaissance.

[baggy1]

Agreed on all that Proth and maybe it will mean adding some better regulations around building in general to allow for conversions but I won't hold my breath on that one. And Cavendish House was just thrown out there as a (bad) example, I'll drive by the swan when I next pop over to see the MIL (where is it in relation to Tesco.) Why didn't they just knock it (CH) down because it has become almost a monument to how Dudley has declined since the old tax office was using it.