Boris Johnson

[baggy1]

And yet the clown in chief who 'Got Brexit Done' was the front man for the Leave campaign. If it wasn't the right deal why did he push ahead with it instead of waiting to get the right one in place?

Either that or there simply wasn't a 'right deal' and the Brexiteers are still arguing that it would have been perfect if it wasn't for those pesky remainers.

[Protheroe]

Like I said BB "The failure of Remain Parliamentarians to consider ANY form of Brexit pretty much booted any compromise forms of Brexit like EFTA out of the window."

And I include members of May's inept and overwhelmingly Remain government in that.

@B1 - if you want to know what goes on in Boris Johnson's mind you're asking the wring person I'm afraid.

[Borin' Baggie]

Like I said BB "The failure of Remain Parliamentarians to consider ANY form of Brexit pretty much booted any compromise forms of Brexit like EFTA out of the window."

And I include members of May's inept and overwhelmingly Remain government in that.

@B1 - if you want to know what goes on in Boris Johnson's mind you're asking the wring person I'm afraid.

You include the group that basically put us onto the path of a hard Brexit as failing to consider any form of Brexit? They blatantly considered one, one designed to appease to Brexiters in the Tory party, as that is what they pushed forward for three years.

And I reiterate, what stopped any form of compromise on Brexit - namely a deal that kept the UK within the single market - was generally Brexiters, specifically those in the Tory party that held the balance of power. The EFTA was on the table for 5 minutes and the Tory Brexiters were the ones who scuppered it, not Remainers. This is coming from someone who cancelled their membership of the Lib Dems after their refusal to follow Norman Lamb on Brexit - if Tory Brexiters were prepared to compromise and voted that forward then that is what we would have ended up with, alas it isn't.

Your argument smacks purely of blaming everyone other than the side you backed for failures, going so far to absolve blame for the people responsible for those failures.

[Shabby Russian]

As I say, I can only speak for what I saw in the seats I worked in, at the start it was absolutely solid and in line for complete landslide territory far above 2019 levels. Week by week that was eroded as slowly but surely cock up after cock up came from CCHQ. Only a seriously brilliant local campaign meant the seat I was in bucked the national trend and increased its majority.

That 200,000 votes was the difference and every one of them imo was lost by the conservatives rather than won by Labour.

Corbyn had an appeal, but it was ridiculously niche in terms of demographic and regional fix, it was never ever spread enough to win an election.

I also agree ref May. She’s a well meaning person who did her best, I actually felt sorry for her, had her campaign been 25% less shit she’d still be PM now. It was a complete clusterfuck - countless people on Election Day had previously pledged their votes but had been totally put off and refused to come out.

The difference between 2017 and 2019 elections was the 1.5 million votes Labour lost, rather than the 200k votes the Tories added.

[TTM2]

As I say, I can only speak for what I saw in the seats I worked in, at the start it was absolutely solid and in line for complete landslide territory far above 2019 levels. Week by week that was eroded as slowly but surely cock up after cock up came from CCHQ. Only a seriously brilliant local campaign meant the seat I was in bucked the national trend and increased its majority.

That 200,000 votes was the difference and every one of them imo was lost by the conservatives rather than won by Labour.

Corbyn had an appeal, but it was ridiculously niche in terms of demographic and regional fix, it was never ever spread enough to win an election.

I also agree ref May. She’s a well meaning person who did her best, I actually felt sorry for her, had her campaign been 25% less shit she’d still be PM now. It was a complete clusterfuck - countless people on Election Day had previously pledged their votes but had been totally put off and refused to come out.

The difference between 2017 and 2019 elections was the 1.5 million votes Labour lost, rather than the 200k votes the Tories added.

They lost both of them.

[Ossian]

And yet the clown in chief who 'Got Brexit Done' was the front man for the Leave campaign. If it wasn't the right deal why did he push ahead with it instead of waiting to get the right one in place?

Either that or there simply wasn't a 'right deal' and the Brexiteers are still arguing that it would have been perfect if it wasn't for those pesky remainers.

Are you one of these 'Uber remainers' who never wanted Brexit, didn't vote for it but are  apparently - and I admit I'm struggling with the train of thought here - somehow to blame for it turning into a shitshow? 

I only ask, because I've never met what I would call an uber remainer: I have bumped into loads of "Oh great, that's fucked it for generations to come" type remainers; no Ubers though. My error has been in assuming that it would be incumbent on those selling something so significant and transformational to have a coherent plan.

[baggy1]

And yet the clown in chief who 'Got Brexit Done' was the front man for the Leave campaign. If it wasn't the right deal why did he push ahead with it instead of waiting to get the right one in place?

Either that or there simply wasn't a 'right deal' and the Brexiteers are still arguing that it would have been perfect if it wasn't for those pesky remainers.

Are you one of these 'Uber remainers' who never wanted Brexit, didn't vote for it but are  apparently - and I admit I'm struggling with the train of thought here - somehow to blame for it turning into a shitshow? 

I only ask, because I've never met what I would call an uber remainer: I have bumped into loads of "Oh great, that's fucked it for generations to come" type remainers; no Ubers though. My error has been in assuming that it would be incumbent on those selling something so significant and transformational to have a coherent plan.

  I'm pretty certain I must be Oss, I do take my responsibility seriously though because it was clearly my fault all along.

[Loanee]

Quite funny saying Corbyn would have been useless when you voted for Johnson

[Derek Hardballs]

Putting the rewriting of Brexit aside, Johnson was and is unfit to be Prime Minister. For those who voted for him to ‘get Brexit done’ they must own to some degree the erosion of truth, facts, integrity and that is damaging democracy. Either they were ignorant of or chose to vote for a man who has been ambivalent about the truth since childhood as pointed out by those who he went to school, university or worked with him.

Some have dismissed or played down Cummings Barnet Castle trip and the impact it had
Some were entirely comfortable with cronyism during the height of the pandemic
Some supported the Brexit deal that is now apparently not fit for purpose
Some scoffed at the dangers of popularism in politics
Equally some scoffed at integrity being important in politics as some outdated romantic notion
Some didn’t mind a bit of finger pointing at teachers, Fire Service, judges, scientists, experts… it’s an ever growing list of people who are to blame for anything that goes wrong!

We now have the government some of us deserve but many don’t. With every new scandal, parliamentary rule breaking, truth twisting some enabled a government or perhaps party to fracture a nation, undermine democracy and whittle away what was left of trust in politicians.

The choice was awful at the last election I admit but there were no secrets to what Johnson and many in his cabinet were like. I had to hold my nose to vote for Labour at the last election but I did so in the hope of hobbling the powers afforded to those now in power.

I ask the question again what is better now than 10 no sorry 13 years ago?

[Pontificator]

Putting the rewriting of Brexit aside, Johnson was and is unfit to be Prime Minister. For those who voted for him to ‘get Brexit done’ they must own to some degree the erosion of truth, facts, integrity and that is damaging democracy. Either they were ignorant of or chose to vote for a man who has been ambivalent about the truth since childhood as pointed out by those who he went to school, university or worked with him.

Some have dismissed or played down Cummings Barnet Castle trip and the impact it had
Some were entirely comfortable with cronyism during the height of the pandemic
Some supported the Brexit deal that is now apparently not fit for purpose
Some scoffed at the dangers of popularism in politics
Equally some scoffed at integrity being important in politics as some outdated romantic notion
Some  didn’t mind a bit of finger pointing at teachers, Fire Service, judges, scientists, experts… it’s an ever growing list of people who are to blame for anything that goes wrong!

We now have the government some of us deserve but many don’t. With every new scandal, parliamentary rule breaking, truth twisting some  enabled a government or perhaps party to fracture a nation, undermine democracy and whittle away what was left of trust in politicians.

The choice was awful at the last election I admit but there were no secrets to what Johnson and many in his cabinet were like. I had to hold my nose to vote for Labour at the last election but I did so in the hope of hobbling the powers afforded to those now in power. 

I ask the question again what is better now than 10 no sorry 13 years ago?

Perhaps compare it to labours achievements in government
https://politicsandinsights.org/2013/06/...we-forget/