Second referendum

[baggy1]

it would be madness for anyone in power to allow a second vote that had the option to remain on it.

Why?

It was an incredibly close vote and clearly the promises of the leave camp don't seem to stand up to the scrutiny. It was treated as a mad by-election protest vote that could impact a generation- I also think many remainers didn't think it would happen so didn't bother voting. If it's truly the will of the people then a second vote would get clarity.

After all I know at least two who voted to leave who now feel they've made a big mistake.

The most absurd reason I have heard for a second vote.

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Ok, I'll accept your view that no-one needs to explain themselves, however in this instance could you give me one benefit that I will see when we leave the EU. Maybe that will help me understand this decision.

[Lillwall's left foot]

I'm impressed by your perseverance! the"nobody needs to explain themselves" response is pure gold, and i believe official ERG policy ?I'm a lefty liberal remainer meself but work with a Tory Leave voter that I both like and respect. From a working class background he studied politics and is both intelligent and thoughtful from very much the centre of the party. I asked him WHY? he had voted leave...

1. Democracy! He objected to the non-democratic nature of the EU, particularly the appointment of senior leaders and the influence they have on the governance of our country.
2. He felt more aligned with America and the Commenwealth countries than our European partners. Felt they should be our long term close trading partners.

He admitted it was unlikely there would be ANY financial gain but hoped for parity in the medium to long term. He hasn't changed his view but thinks May is utterly clueless and is exasperated at how his party has managed this exit.

A little insight into one leavers mindset.

[Pertensio]

it would be madness for anyone in power to allow a second vote that had the option to remain on it.

Why?

It was an incredibly close vote and clearly the promises of the leave camp don't seem to stand up to the scrutiny. It was treated as a mad by-election protest vote that could impact a generation- I also think many remainers didn't think it would happen so didn't bother voting. If it's truly the will of the people then a second vote would get clarity.

After all I know at least two who voted to leave who now feel they've made a big mistake.

The most absurd reason I have heard for a second vote.

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Court of Appeal (Wilson) Sir James Eadie QC for Theresa May, argued that Parliament had moved in on the process, it was too late for law to be upheld. Any challenge now would prejudice good admin. 

There was he said, no error of fact, PM proceeded knowing the process was unlawful

[Duffers]

it would be madness for anyone in power to allow a second vote that had the option to remain on it.

Why?

It was an incredibly close vote and clearly the promises of the leave camp don't seem to stand up to the scrutiny. It was treated as a mad by-election protest vote that could impact a generation- I also think many remainers didn't think it would happen so didn't bother voting. If it's truly the will of the people then a second vote would get clarity.

After all I know at least two who voted to leave who now feel they've made a big mistake.

The most absurd reason I have heard for a second vote.

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won.

And what a victory it has been, I think we can all agree that the country is a much better place now since that momentous day in June 2016, happy, harmonious with a bright future mapped out in front of it...

Or people could just admit they were lied to by a bus.

[cornishbaggie]

Why?

It was an incredibly close vote and clearly the promises of the leave camp don't seem to stand up to the scrutiny. It was treated as a mad by-election protest vote that could impact a generation- I also think many remainers didn't think it would happen so didn't bother voting. If it's truly the will of the people then a second vote would get clarity.

After all I know at least two who voted to leave who now feel they've made a big mistake.

The most absurd reason I have heard for a second vote.

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Ok, I'll accept your view that no-one needs to explain themselves, however in this instance could you give me one benefit that I will see when we leave the EU. Maybe that will help me understand this decision.

I sense you are keen on questions, so please allow me a few, what happens to the 17.4 million when they are told their votes are null and void. When the losers referendum is held, what is the criteria, will it be the best of three, best of five. Will we be told " it's only this time your vote won't count, it will every other, honest ". Now that politicians are ignoring a vote and proceeding how they want, isn't that a dictatorship. What are the masses next steps, now they know democracy is denied them, the last time anyone were denied votes in the UK was Northern Ireland, that went well.

[Duffers]

The most absurd reason I have heard for a second vote.

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Ok, I'll accept your view that no-one needs to explain themselves, however in this instance could you give me one benefit that I will see when we leave the EU. Maybe that will help me understand this decision.

I sense you are keen on questions, so please allow me a few, what happens to the 17.4 million when they are told their votes are null and void. When the losers referendum is held, what is the criteria, will it be the best of three, best of five. Will we be told " it's only this time your vote won't count, it will every other, honest ". Now that politicians are ignoring a vote and proceeding how they want, isn't that a dictatorship. What are the masses next steps, now they know democracy is denied them, the last time anyone were denied votes in the UK was Northern Ireland, that went well.

I would say that new information has come to light since the first vote, ie people are realising that the leave campaign was founded on a pack of lies lead by people more interested in their own agendas and ambitions than the good of this country. The act of exiting the EU is going to be a complete horror show (still waiting for someone to name a benefit). Businesses are already fleeing and these benefits of leaving are yet to materialise. So yes, I’d say a second referendum is necessary. Consider it an “are you sure?” vote with three options on the ballot - Remain, Leave with no deal, Leave with whatever deal May and her band of fuckwits manage to cobble together. Of course if the two Leave options get over 50% between them they win.

[baggy1]

I sense you are keen on questions, so please allow me a few, what happens to the 17.4 million when they are told their votes are null and void. When the losers referendum is held, what is the criteria, will it be the best of three, best of five. Will we be told " it's only this time your vote won't count, it will every other, honest ". Now that politicians are ignoring a vote and proceeding how they want, isn't that a dictatorship. What are the masses next steps, now they know democracy is denied them, the last time anyone were denied votes in the UK was Northern Ireland, that went well.

No problems Cornish.

The votes aren't null and void, in the same way that any election / referendum votes aren't. The vote to stay in the EEC in 1975 aren't void because we have voted to leave now, circumstances have changed. The votes to elect Theresa May's government won't be null and void at the next election, we have simply seen it was the wrong thing to vote for with the benefit of hindsight.

And let's not get hung up on the 17.4 million, I would say that there are a fair few of those that with hindsight can see it isn't a very good idea in practice rather than the theory. Also there were 16.1 million voters that voted to remain and have watched the car crash of the last couple of years unfolding predictably in amazement.

The argument that we've voted and it must be upheld for democracy doesn't hold water based on a simple fact - people change their mind, and when they can see no benefit to following something through logic would dictate that they stop and turn around.

This really is as simple as that, people voted for leave, it turns out it's a really shit idea and has no benefits, so let's rethink the situation and ask again now that we know more. That is democracy in action - not a denial of democracy.

Now - seeing as I have answered your questions. Can I ask again for you to give me one benefit to the country, the economy, our job prospects, our children's futures, or absolutely anything by leaving.

[Sunshine]

And this is why I don't like over-complicating the subject. Forget about any reason why we should have another vote, can someone please spell out in simple terms why it will be a good idea to leave the EU. I must have asked this four times on here without an answer.

I could take from the silence that there isn't really a good reason to leave the EU (that stands up anymore) and that really is the reason why we need a second vote.

I am willing to be convinced otherwise though - if someone can tell me the benefits we will receive by leaving I would appreciate it.

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Ok, I'll accept your view that no-one needs to explain themselves, however in this instance could you give me one benefit that I will see when we leave the EU. Maybe that will help me understand this decision.

I sense you are keen on questions, so please allow me a few, what happens to the 17.4 million when they are told their votes are null and void. When the losers referendum is held, what is the criteria, will it be the best of three, best of five. Will we be told " it's only this time your vote won't count, it will every other, honest ". Now that politicians are ignoring a vote and proceeding how they want, isn't that a dictatorship. What are the masses next steps, now they know democracy is denied them, the last time anyone were denied votes in the UK was Northern Ireland, that went well.

I would say that new information has come to light since the first vote, ie people are realising that the leave campaign was founded on a pack of lies lead by people more interested in their own agendas and ambitions than the good of this country. The act of exiting the EU is going to be a complete horror show (still waiting for someone to name a benefit). Businesses are already fleeing and these benefits of leaving are yet to materialise. So yes, I’d say a second referendum is necessary. Consider it an “are you sure?” vote with three options on the ballot - Remain, Leave with no deal, Leave with whatever deal May and her band of fuckwits manage to cobble together. Of course if the two Leave options get over 50% between them they win.

What would happen in that situation say if result was

Remain 48%
Leave no deal 26%
Leave with deal 26%

Another referendum with only the 2 leave options on the ballot paper?

[Duffers]

I think the silence is because nobody needs to explain themselves, the vote has been won. The only explanation needed now is why democracy is being ignored and politicians of all sides failing in their duty, to carry out the will of the people. All due respects but nobody needs to try and convince you.

Ok, I'll accept your view that no-one needs to explain themselves, however in this instance could you give me one benefit that I will see when we leave the EU. Maybe that will help me understand this decision.

I sense you are keen on questions, so please allow me a few, what happens to the 17.4 million when they are told their votes are null and void. When the losers referendum is held, what is the criteria, will it be the best of three, best of five. Will we be told " it's only this time your vote won't count, it will every other, honest ". Now that politicians are ignoring a vote and proceeding how they want, isn't that a dictatorship. What are the masses next steps, now they know democracy is denied them, the last time anyone were denied votes in the UK was Northern Ireland, that went well.

I would say that new information has come to light since the first vote, ie people are realising that the leave campaign was founded on a pack of lies lead by people more interested in their own agendas and ambitions than the good of this country. The act of exiting the EU is going to be a complete horror show (still waiting for someone to name a benefit). Businesses are already fleeing and these benefits of leaving are yet to materialise. So yes, I’d say a second referendum is necessary. Consider it an “are you sure?” vote with three options on the ballot - Remain, Leave with no deal, Leave with whatever deal May and her band of fuckwits manage to cobble together. Of course if the two Leave options get over 50% between them they win.

What would happen in that situation say if result was

Remain 48%
Leave no deal 26%
Leave with deal 26%

Another referendum with only the 2 leave options on the ballot paper?

Unless there was a dead heat between the two leave options the one with the most votes wins.

[Babel]

One good reason for not having a second referendum is because the world is exactly the same as it was when the leave vote was recorded. The clocks stopped, simply. The second good reason is related to the "never ask an idiot" adage.

More seriously, there is a dead easy way of holding a referendum: go through with the Euro election in the summer, but insist that the candidates are very clearly for or against leave. That would in reality give a second referendum without all the bollocks.