Is there a lockdown at all?
#21
(01-12-2021, 03:55 PM)Fido Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 02:12 PM)baggy1 Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 02:05 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 02:01 PM)Spandaubaggie Wrote: It's a month or two to get things under control. Not ever. Really from a common-sense point of view a short term choice between saving lives and getting the economy on its feet I can't see the other side of the argument.

Most kids (including mine) have gone almost nine months without formal education. By the end of this it will probably be a year.

Common sense suggests that's a major issue.

So why don't you think redoing the year would be a good idea? You seem to think they need it otherwise they will be disadvantaged, so why not?

And to counter that we obviously have the logistics of adding a whole year of students to the 'school age' groups without being able to physically expand schools or increase required teachers to keep classroom sizes down, but surely there should be some approach that gives your kids the education that they have missed.

Struggling universities would also miss a year of revenue from UK-based kids, I guess, and if you did include uni students you'd have a year of people not in the job market. Keep as is, use public and private resources to help get kids on-line and make allowances for the difference in education provided.

I guess Rishi's magic wallet will have to come into play Fido.

This time represents an opportunity to update an educational system that is shockingly similar to when I was a long haired shoplifting lout in Bearwood 40 years ago.

It's a time we started looking at bringing education in line with the change in society.

Personally, but I'm very much in a middle England idyll, both my kids are enjoying lessons at home. My daughter is studious anyway and my lad does his lessons and then goes on his X box or phone, occasionally appearing to ask for bacon sandwiches or omelettes.

Anyhow, point is the lockdown seems very lax and can see shocking figures the next few weeks before the most vulnerable are vaccinated.
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#22
Reading this with interest although my kids have all left school and me with no strong opinions either way. Isn't school about more than education though? Don't kids need companionship? FWIW (and in no way connected with the thread), I'm all for more technical type training, proper apprenticeships. I was so bored at school I hardly ever went but once I got earning wages, I was straight to night school to get City and Guild qualifications to try and earn more.
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#23
(01-12-2021, 03:42 PM)Spandaubaggie Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 02:05 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 02:01 PM)Spandaubaggie Wrote: It's a month or two to get things under control. Not ever. Really from a common-sense point of view a short term choice between saving lives and getting the economy on its feet I can't see the other side of the argument.

Most kids (including mine) have gone almost nine months without formal education. By the end of this it will probably be a year.

Common sense suggests that's a major issue.

Being a year behind education wise or deaths galore of their grandparents?

FWIW my daughter had severe anxiety problems which meant she barely attended school in year 8 and 9. We got private help and she ended up with, despite missing probably 18 months off school, very good GCSEs. She is now flying at her first year A'levels and her teachers expect she will get grades good enough to ensure she does a recognised degree at a Russell Group Uni.

That was without 18 months education.

OK, she's from a stable family, with both of us fairly decently educated, (both doing it ourselves in adulthood) but it shows we all develop at our own levels and the constant over-emphasis on testing and pushy parents squealing about league tables does my bonce in.

The education argument is, my common-sense would suggest, ridiculously flimsy compared to possibly 50,000 more deaths.

It's not a zero sum game. It's not a choice between the two. If that's the level of debate then I'm out.
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#24
Sorry after ten years of cutting services to vulnerable young people including libraries, youth centres, mental health services, YOI courses, youth crime prevention etc I have absolutely no time for Conservative Libertarian types bleating on about the most vulnerable children. They wore their pro austerity / wear small state, low tax badges with pride! Only a few months ago they had to be dragged kicking and screaming to support free school meals at October half term and only after being embarrassed by Marcus Rashford.
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#25
(01-12-2021, 05:46 PM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Sorry after ten years of cutting services to vulnerable young people including libraries, youth centres, mental health services, YOI courses, youth crime prevention etc I have absolutely no time for Conservative Libertarian types bleating on about the most vulnerable children. They wore  austerity / wear small state, low tax badges with pride!

Hard to argue with this.
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#26
(01-12-2021, 05:46 PM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Sorry after ten years of cutting services to vulnerable young people including libraries, youth centres, mental health services, YOI courses, youth crime prevention etc I have absolutely no time for Conservative Libertarian types bleating on about the most vulnerable children. They wore  austerity / wear small state, low tax badges with pride!

You doubt my sincerity? Never mind, I'll live. Don't choke on your bitterness eh?
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#27
(01-12-2021, 05:50 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 05:46 PM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Sorry after ten years of cutting services to vulnerable young people including libraries, youth centres, mental health services, YOI courses, youth crime prevention etc I have absolutely no time for Conservative Libertarian types bleating on about the most vulnerable children. They wore  austerity / wear small state, low tax badges with pride!

You doubt my sincerity? Never mind, I'll live. Don't choke on your bitterness eh?

Just pointing out the hypocrisy of those in the Conservatives party who are now suddenly concerned for the most vulnerable. The actions of the party over the last decade suggests quite the contrary. The reply wasn’t to you, you did leave on principle but those in your former party who are either cynical or blind to the hypocrisy of their words and actions when it comes to the most vulnerable.

Pointing out hypocrisy isn’t bitterness.
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#28
All MP'S are hypocritical wankers red and blue rosettes don't matter all shit in the same bucket.... I don't know one decent one with a clear head who havnt lied through their teeth to us and continue to spin labour and tory party lies.
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#29
[Image: ErmfZ11XEAABLHQ?format=jpg&name=medium]
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#30
(01-12-2021, 06:33 PM)Derek Hardballs Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 05:50 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(01-12-2021, 05:46 PM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Sorry after ten years of cutting services to vulnerable young people including libraries, youth centres, mental health services, YOI courses, youth crime prevention etc I have absolutely no time for Conservative Libertarian types bleating on about the most vulnerable children. They wore  austerity / wear small state, low tax badges with pride!

You doubt my sincerity? Never mind, I'll live. Don't choke on your bitterness eh?

Just pointing out the hypocrisy of those in the Conservatives party who are now suddenly concerned for the most vulnerable. The actions of the party over the last decade suggests quite the contrary. The reply wasn’t to you, you did leave on principle but those in your former party who are either cynical or blind to the hypocrisy of their words and actions when it comes to the most vulnerable.

Pointing out hypocrisy isn’t bitterness.

It is if you don't understand the motivations of those who think differently from you. The outcomes you and I want for the UK's poorest kids are, I assume, very similar (unless you are daft enough to believe I really am evil).

We differ on the the means of achieving those outcomes. It's the same for employment, climate, transport, trade in fact anything you choose. You favour more state intervention, I favour less or none at all. What I'm sure we can agree on is that education is absolutely central to outcomes for the poorest. Outcomes and university entrance have never been better for the poorest kids and we risk throwing an awful lot of that away through lack of engagement.

I never did have a low tax / small state badge to wear with pride either - because throughout the last decade taxes have generally risen and the state has generally grown in size. I'm sorry that doesn't chime with your victimhood narrative, but it is the truth. Now the state is bigger than ever. You won.
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