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+--- Thread: UK Covid death toll (/showthread.php?tid=10162)
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RE: UK Covid death toll - baggiebuckster - 12-12-2021
According to certain people the reason that South Africa only had mild cases is because they have a younger population. They also only have a 25% jab rate and zero deaths. So many unjabbed young people would have caught Omicron and brushed it off. Yet we are going to cancel NHS procedures and appointments to prioritise jabbing young people who have already had 2 jabs.
RE: UK Covid death toll - JOK - 12-13-2021
(12-12-2021, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: At present we have barely any safeguards in place at Primary and at senior school we have finally started vaccinations and bizarrely enforcing mask wearing in corridors and communal spaces but not in classrooms (virus doesn’t like lessons apparently). There haven’t been any ventilation systems put in place when we had months to do so last summer. There is very little that makes any sense health wise with regards to keeping children safe from the virus.
I certainly don’t want my children off school, I want them to have the best education they can have but I also realise that just saying kids should be at school regardless of the spread of the virus is not necessarily practical, safe or realistic if the virus is just allowed to rip through the schools over the next few months.
It sounds a good idea but how do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
What are these ventilation systems that are readily available can be easily installed without detailed surveys of the buildings? Where are all the qualified installation engineers to be found? And all this to be done in months?
So, we continue to hamper a generation’s education and possibly more important, social development? (Which you will complain about, down the line, ignoring the fact that you called for it)
(12-12-2021, 12:07 PM)baggy1 Wrote: Closing schools early in the pandemic and up until we had the vaccination program in place was key to reducing spread and keeping hospitalisation numbers down. That also gave the government time to roll out measures for schools including ventilation systems, protection for teachers and other staff and testing systems in place to allow schools to reopen whilst protecting the staff. What surprises me, when tbh I’m surprised that I am surprised, is that the DFE hasn’t rolled out improved ventilation systems (not just opening a window) to all schools. I would have thought this would have been the minimum.
Genuine question above, posed to Dekka, perhaps you can / will answer this for me.
How do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
RE: UK Covid death toll - Derek Hardballs - 12-13-2021
(12-13-2021, 08:32 AM)JOK Wrote:(12-12-2021, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: At present we have barely any safeguards in place at Primary and at senior school we have finally started vaccinations and bizarrely enforcing mask wearing in corridors and communal spaces but not in classrooms (virus doesn’t like lessons apparently). There haven’t been any ventilation systems put in place when we had months to do so last summer. There is very little that makes any sense health wise with regards to keeping children safe from the virus.
I certainly don’t want my children off school, I want them to have the best education they can have but I also realise that just saying kids should be at school regardless of the spread of the virus is not necessarily practical, safe or realistic if the virus is just allowed to rip through the schools over the next few months.
It sounds a good idea but how do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
What are these ventilation systems that are readily available can be easily installed without detailed surveys of the buildings? Where are all the qualified installation engineers to be found? And all this to be done in months?
So, we continue to hamper a generation’s education and possibly more important, social development? (Which you will complain about, down the line, ignoring the fact that you called for it)
So we do next to nothing to keep schools safe because it’s too complicated for this government to deliver? We have had at least a 18mths to start putting better ventilation in place and generally making schools safer. The only thing we have at the moment is the ability to open a window! We only ask young people to wear masks in communal areas for no logical reasons and testing is pretty much based on trust.
How can you keep school’s running if you let this more contagious version of Covid rip through schools If you get numerous teachers and half a year group off? How is that going to help childrens education? This argument that schools must stay open no matter what is flying in the face of practical problems as basic as do we have enough staff that are well to keep them running?
Six cases already reported over the weekend from schools my children attend. Only one member of staff in school office due to Covid
RE: UK Covid death toll - baggy1 - 12-13-2021
(12-13-2021, 08:32 AM)JOK Wrote:(12-12-2021, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: At present we have barely any safeguards in place at Primary and at senior school we have finally started vaccinations and bizarrely enforcing mask wearing in corridors and communal spaces but not in classrooms (virus doesn’t like lessons apparently). There haven’t been any ventilation systems put in place when we had months to do so last summer. There is very little that makes any sense health wise with regards to keeping children safe from the virus.
I certainly don’t want my children off school, I want them to have the best education they can have but I also realise that just saying kids should be at school regardless of the spread of the virus is not necessarily practical, safe or realistic if the virus is just allowed to rip through the schools over the next few months.
It sounds a good idea but how do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
What are these ventilation systems that are readily available can be easily installed without detailed surveys of the buildings? Where are all the qualified installation engineers to be found? And all this to be done in months?
So, we continue to hamper a generation’s education and possibly more important, social development? (Which you will complain about, down the line, ignoring the fact that you called for it)
(12-12-2021, 12:07 PM)baggy1 Wrote: Closing schools early in the pandemic and up until we had the vaccination program in place was key to reducing spread and keeping hospitalisation numbers down. That also gave the government time to roll out measures for schools including ventilation systems, protection for teachers and other staff and testing systems in place to allow schools to reopen whilst protecting the staff. What surprises me, when tbh I’m surprised that I am surprised, is that the DFE hasn’t rolled out improved ventilation systems (not just opening a window) to all schools. I would have thought this would have been the minimum.
Genuine question above, posed to Dekka, perhaps you can / will answer this for me.
How do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
I'd be looking at standing ventilation systems rather than having a building revamp and installing the air conditioning units that people think of. I would also be looking at some of the wasted billions on PPE contracts that weren't fit for purpose and going after the conmen that took advantage of a lax system to effectively cream off the top by acting as middlemen. Maybe Dyson or JCB could have thrown something together that is closer to their field instead of focussing on medical equipment. And as for the timescale, there were 12 months where schools were empty and I posted something about this very early on in the pandemic, I can't imagine that I was the only one that thought protecting teachers was a good idea., they should have been on this from the get go, it was clear that this wasn't going to over by summer in March 2020.
(12-12-2021, 10:57 PM)baggiebuckster Wrote: According to certain people the reason that South Africa only had mild cases is because they have a younger population. They also only have a 25% jab rate and zero deaths. So many unjabbed young people would have caught Omicron and brushed it off. Yet we are going to cancel NHS procedures and appointments to prioritise jabbing young people who have already had 2 jabs.
Th cancelling of procedures and appointments only occurs when the hospitalisations get too high for hospitals to cope and resource has to be shifted. Nobody is cancelling procedures / appointments on the off chance it will be bad, all is as normal at the moment trying to deal with the backlog.
RE: UK Covid death toll - baggiebuckster - 12-13-2021
(12-13-2021, 09:40 AM)baggy1 Wrote:(12-13-2021, 08:32 AM)JOK Wrote:(12-12-2021, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: At present we have barely any safeguards in place at Primary and at senior school we have finally started vaccinations and bizarrely enforcing mask wearing in corridors and communal spaces but not in classrooms (virus doesn’t like lessons apparently). There haven’t been any ventilation systems put in place when we had months to do so last summer. There is very little that makes any sense health wise with regards to keeping children safe from the virus.
I certainly don’t want my children off school, I want them to have the best education they can have but I also realise that just saying kids should be at school regardless of the spread of the virus is not necessarily practical, safe or realistic if the virus is just allowed to rip through the schools over the next few months.
It sounds a good idea but how do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
What are these ventilation systems that are readily available can be easily installed without detailed surveys of the buildings? Where are all the qualified installation engineers to be found? And all this to be done in months?
So, we continue to hamper a generation’s education and possibly more important, social development? (Which you will complain about, down the line, ignoring the fact that you called for it)
(12-12-2021, 12:07 PM)baggy1 Wrote: Closing schools early in the pandemic and up until we had the vaccination program in place was key to reducing spread and keeping hospitalisation numbers down. That also gave the government time to roll out measures for schools including ventilation systems, protection for teachers and other staff and testing systems in place to allow schools to reopen whilst protecting the staff. What surprises me, when tbh I’m surprised that I am surprised, is that the DFE hasn’t rolled out improved ventilation systems (not just opening a window) to all schools. I would have thought this would have been the minimum.
Genuine question above, posed to Dekka, perhaps you can / will answer this for me.
How do you finance and practically install the modern efficient ventilation systems in 24,360 schools in England, in the required time scale you suggest?
I'd be looking at standing ventilation systems rather than having a building revamp and installing the air conditioning units that people think of. I would also be looking at some of the wasted billions on PPE contracts that weren't fit for purpose and going after the conmen that took advantage of a lax system to effectively cream off the top by acting as middlemen. Maybe Dyson or JCB could have thrown something together that is closer to their field instead of focussing on medical equipment. And as for the timescale, there were 12 months where schools were empty and I posted something about this very early on in the pandemic, I can't imagine that I was the only one that thought protecting teachers was a good idea., they should have been on this from the get go, it was clear that this wasn't going to over by summer in March 2020.
(12-12-2021, 10:57 PM)baggiebuckster Wrote: According to certain people the reason that South Africa only had mild cases is because they have a younger population. They also only have a 25% jab rate and zero deaths. So many unjabbed young people would have caught Omicron and brushed it off. Yet we are going to cancel NHS procedures and appointments to prioritise jabbing young people who have already had 2 jabs.
Th cancelling of procedures and appointments only occurs when the hospitalisations get too high for hospitals to cope and resource has to be shifted. Nobody is cancelling procedures / appointments on the off chance it will be bad, all is as normal at the moment trying to deal with the backlog.
You are wrong baggy1
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/12/13/boris-johnson-news-conservative-mps-boosters-sajid-javid/
RE: UK Covid death toll - baggy1 - 12-13-2021
(12-13-2021, 10:11 AM)baggiebuckster Wrote:(12-13-2021, 09:40 AM)baggy1 Wrote:(12-12-2021, 10:57 PM)baggiebuckster Wrote: According to certain people the reason that South Africa only had mild cases is because they have a younger population. They also only have a 25% jab rate and zero deaths. So many unjabbed young people would have caught Omicron and brushed it off. Yet we are going to cancel NHS procedures and appointments to prioritise jabbing young people who have already had 2 jabs.
The cancelling of procedures and appointments only occurs when the hospitalisations get too high for hospitals to cope and resource has to be shifted. Nobody is cancelling procedures / appointments on the off chance it will be bad, all is as normal at the moment trying to deal with the backlog.
You are wrong baggy1
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/12/13/boris-johnson-news-conservative-mps-boosters-sajid-javid/
I really wouldn't be taking the word of the Torygraph on the subject bucky, this is Good old Saj on the BBC this very morning: "It does mean, when it comes to primary care for the next few weeks, our GPs will only be focussing on urgent needs and vaccinations and it also means mon-urgent appointments and elective surgeries may have to be postponed in the new year.".... Cancer appointments ...."will be completely unaffected... that is an urgent appointment and will remain a priority". When asked about people who, for example, think they might have breast cancer who normally get seen within two weeks, he replied "That will be completely unaffected by this mission"
What you have to read between the lines is who is reporting things - the Torygraph is standing up for freedom and don't believe in masks or any restrictions. As I can't see what they have said because thankfully I don't subscribe to their poisonous shite, I can't see the words actually quoted only the misleading and no doubt nuanced headline.
RE: UK Covid death toll - baggiebuckster - 12-13-2021
Try the Boris transcript then - he clearly says
'And as we focus on boosters and make this new target achievable, it will mean some other appointments will need to be postponed until the New Year.'
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/prime-ministers-address-to-the-nation-on-booster-jabs-12-december-2021
RE: UK Covid death toll - baggy1 - 12-13-2021
(12-13-2021, 10:27 AM)baggiebuckster Wrote: Try the Boris transcript then - he clearly says
'And as we focus on boosters and make this new target achievable, it will mean some other appointments will need to be postponed until the New Year.'
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/prime-ministers-address-to-the-nation-on-booster-jabs-12-december-2021
Again, I would be reading that as GP appointments and maybe I should have been clear when talking about hospitalisations that I meant hospital appointments.
RE: UK Covid death toll - Derek Hardballs - 12-13-2021
Only 9 off in my son’s English class off today with Covid… I wonder when the English teachers get’s ill?
RE: UK Covid death toll - Derek Hardballs - 12-14-2021
This is the calibre of freedom fighters speaking in Parliament…
Conservative MP Desmond Swayne says the “carnage” on UK roads is “certainly killing more people than Covid at the moment”.
For context there were just 1,460 deaths on British roads in the whole of 2020, compared to more than 4,000 deaths of people with Covid last month alone.