(02-20-2021, 11:05 AM)richbaggie Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:45 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:40 AM)richbaggie Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:12 AM)strawman Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 08:50 AM)richbaggie Wrote: I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.

They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.

If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with

Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.

I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.

When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.

Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.

 I was under the impression vulnerable children were able to have the jab or have I misread that?

I understand your reasoning Derek but I don't think a roadmap that works for everyone is feasible and would take too long to get to and the dangers elsewhere of extended lockdown outweighs the dangers of covid.

Derek Hardballs Wrote:

richbaggie Wrote:

Derek Hardballs Wrote:

richbaggie Wrote:

strawman Wrote:They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.

If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with

Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.

I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.

When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.

Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.

 I was under the impression vulnerable children were able to have the jab or have I misread that?

I understand your reasoning Derek but I don't think a roadmap that works for everyone is feasible and would take too long to get to and the dangers elsewhere of extended lockdown outweighs the dangers of covid.

Vulnerable children over twelve at the discretion of their specialists and I could be wrong in residential care. Those under who are classed as disabled and vulnerable and who are not in residential care setting are not currently even on the list for the vaccine.

What are families with vulnerable children expected to do? Where is their way out? We still have thousands of cases a day, there is no testing in schools, work places for many aren’t safe so that leaves thousands of the ‘most vulnerable’ and their families under house arrest (shielding for twelve months now) whilst everyone else can go back to playing sport, pub etc. Our priority should be to protect and vaccinate the most vulnerable rather than expect them to hide away for the benefit of others. It’s a lie peddled by the media and government that they have protected the most vulnerable first given the fact that disabled children haven’t been vaccinated and neither have a considerable amount of disabled adults. If this was any other demographic in this country be it elderly, bame etc it would be declared completely unacceptable but it seems it’s met with a few tuts and well it’s for the greater good.

(02-20-2021, 11:43 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 11:05 AM)richbaggie Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:45 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:40 AM)richbaggie Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 09:12 AM)strawman Wrote: They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.

If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with

Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.

I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.

When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.

Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.

 I was under the impression vulnerable children were able to have the jab or have I misread that?

I understand your reasoning Derek but I don't think a roadmap that works for everyone is feasible and would take too long to get to and the dangers elsewhere of extended lockdown outweighs the dangers of covid.

Vulnerable children over twelve at the discretion of their specialists and I could be wrong in residential care. Those under who are classed as disabled and vulnerable and who are not in residential care setting are not currently even on the list for the vaccine.

What are families with vulnerable children expected to do? Where is their way out? We still have thousands of cases a day, there is no testing in schools, work places for many aren’t safe so that leaves thousands of the ‘most vulnerable’ and their families under house arrest (shielding for twelve months now) whilst everyone else can go back to playing sport, pub etc. Our priority should be to protect and vaccinate the most vulnerable rather than expect them to hide away for the benefit of others. It’s a lie peddled by the media and government that they have protected the most vulnerable first given the fact that disabled children haven’t been vaccinated and neither have a considerable amount of disabled adults. If this was any other demographic in this country be it elderly, bame etc it would be declared completely unacceptable but it seems it’s met with a few tuts and well it’s for the greater good.

(02-20-2021, 12:17 PM)richbaggie Wrote: Do we make everyone wait before opening up?

(02-20-2021, 01:48 PM)Protheroe Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 12:17 PM)richbaggie Wrote: Do we make everyone wait before opening up?

The government will be damned if it does and damned if it doesn't.

I'm expecting the next schism to be the clamour from the vaccinated to be allowed to go on foreign holidays by late Spring. I can see the reception to that prospect by the under 40s being very badly received.

Opening up is going to be horrid, and will piss off as many people as it pleases. To be honest, bar the schools opening I'm pretty much past caring.

(02-21-2021, 10:40 AM)Brentbaggie Wrote: The major political pressure is from his back benchers, whom I suspect would rather the streets were littered with the dead rather than see their share and investment portfolio take much more of a hit.  I think Boris resisting them is just about the most prime ministerial thing he's ever done.

Derek Hardballs Wrote:

Brentbaggie Wrote:The major political pressure is from his back benchers, whom I suspect would rather the streets were littered with the dead rather than see their share and investment portfolio take much more of a hit.  I think Boris resisting them is just about the most prime ministerial thing he's ever done.

Quite, Steve an idiots idea of a clever person Baker opinion should be resisted on pretty much any subject!

(02-21-2021, 10:56 AM)EastMidsBaggie Wrote:

Derek Hardballs Wrote:

Brentbaggie Wrote:The major political pressure is from his back benchers, whom I suspect would rather the streets were littered with the dead rather than see their share and investment portfolio take much more of a hit.  I think Boris resisting them is just about the most prime ministerial thing he's ever done.

Quite, Steve an idiots idea of a clever person Baker opinion should be resisted on pretty much any subject!

Steve 'Brexit Hardman' Baker if you please!

Still love to know who's behind such disingenuous and sociopathic characters.

(02-21-2021, 02:18 PM)Ossian Wrote:

(02-21-2021, 10:56 AM)EastMidsBaggie Wrote:

Derek Hardballs Wrote:

Brentbaggie Wrote:The major political pressure is from his back benchers, whom I suspect would rather the streets were littered with the dead rather than see their share and investment portfolio take much more of a hit.  I think Boris resisting them is just about the most prime ministerial thing he's ever done.

Quite, Steve an idiots idea of a clever person Baker opinion should be resisted on pretty much any subject!

Steve 'Brexit Hardman' Baker if you please!

Still love to know who's behind such disingenuous and sociopathic characters.

It's surprising how the views of so many sociopathic arseholes are informed by their 'faith'.

Actually, on reflection, it isn't.