(02-20-2021, 08:34 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ]Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
I watched something on sky news about bame in Oldham and how bad it is in their community until EVERYONE is on board with vaccination we are on to a losing battle..... There are 3 or 4 generations in some households no fault of there own due to family circumstances.... It can go through a house in a day and can you imagine they take it to school.
(02-20-2021, 08:50 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:34 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ]Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
(02-20-2021, 08:56 AM)The liquidator Wrote: [ -> ]I watched something on sky news about bame in Oldham and how bad it is in their community until EVERYONE is on board with vaccination we are on to a losing battle..... There are 3 or 4 generations in some households no fault of there own due to family circumstances.... It can go through a house in a day and can you imagine they take it to school.
You aren't ever going to get anywhere near everyone being on board though. Rough estimates are anything between 50 to 80% needed reading stuff on this.
Ultimately, it's about getting the vulnerable vaccinated.
(02-20-2021, 09:16 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:56 AM)The liquidator Wrote: [ -> ]I watched something on sky news about bame in Oldham and how bad it is in their community until EVERYONE is on board with vaccination we are on to a losing battle..... There are 3 or 4 generations in some households no fault of there own due to family circumstances.... It can go through a house in a day and can you imagine they take it to school.
You aren't ever going to get anywhere near everyone being on board though. Rough estimates are anything between 50 to 80% needed reading stuff on this.
Ultimately, it's about getting the vulnerable vaccinated.
Disabled adults and children who are six times more likely to die from Covid than any other demographic including older people haven’t been vaccinated yet and we have people banging the drum for going back to normal-ish by May including those in the current Conservative party.
(02-20-2021, 09:12 AM)strawman Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:50 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:34 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ]Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.
I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.
(02-20-2021, 09:40 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 09:12 AM)strawman Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:50 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:34 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ]Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.
I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.
When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.
Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.
Derek Hardballs Wrote:richbaggie Wrote:strawman Wrote:richbaggie Wrote:Derek Hardballs Wrote:Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.
I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.
When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.
Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.
So would vaccinations for this group resolve this? When they are vaccinating 400,000+ people a day, surely this is an easy fix?
(02-20-2021, 10:12 AM)Tom Joad Wrote: [ -> ]Derek Hardballs Wrote:richbaggie Wrote:strawman Wrote:richbaggie Wrote:I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.
I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.
When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.
Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.
So would vaccinations for this group resolve this? When they are vaccinating 400,000+ people a day, surely this is an easy fix?
Adults with learning difficulties who remember are six times more likely to die than others are in category six, bizarrely those with Downs are in category 4? There is no logic or imo science behind that decision. Children under 12 who are classed as extremely / vulnerable cannot currently have the vaccine. So they are stuck until or if a vaccine becomes available.
(02-20-2021, 09:45 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 09:40 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 09:12 AM)strawman Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:50 AM)richbaggie Wrote: [ -> ] (02-20-2021, 08:34 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: [ -> ]Open the schools fully and watch yet another spike in cases. Every time we get the situation under control there is a headlong rush to unlock way beyond common sense, let alone the science.
I think the dangers of not looking at mental health is now at critical point that outweighs not opening things up slowly. The difference between opening up now compared to opening up last autumn is huge given the vaccination program and very positive data coming out about its effectiveness.
They are seeing more younger people in hospital, the age that people have children in school. They will not have been vaccinated and while they don't die they spend more time in hospital.
If the kids are to go back to school then they must ensure that mass testing takes place, those testing positive are not allowed in school to protect both teachers and indirect transmission to the families of every child that child has had contact with
Agree about the testing, although not got a lot of confidence in LFT but better than nothing.
I would keep vulnerable children away however until they are vaccinated. I think we are getting to the stage where a more targeted approach is needed as opposed to a one size fits all approach to lockdown.
When’s that going to be? They’ve only just started trials, meanwhile those kids and families get punished educationally and emotionally far longer than anyone else. Also it’s not as simple as just shielding them because many vulnerable children will have siblings who have to go to school and how do you protect the vulnerable child who isn’t at school when their brothers and sisters bring it home? Or does the whole family have to carry on shielding indefinitely? If there is a roadmap out it has to be for everyone otherwise I can see many lawsuits in the medium term as the clamour to get back to normal continues without any real thought for those families.
Rant over and it’s not aimed at you but the situation thousands of people are in that seems to be ignored by the media.
I was under the impression vulnerable children were able to have the jab or have I misread that?
I understand your reasoning Derek but I don't think a roadmap that works for everyone is feasible and would take too long to get to and the dangers elsewhere of extended lockdown outweighs the dangers of covid.