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Lessons from the last 8 years in the PL
#11
Complacency is the route of the fallen in the Premiership. We wrote our own obituary when we gave in at 40 points the season before and never recovered until Big Dave rode in.
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#12
(06-13-2018, 09:56 AM)Bromley Baggie Wrote:
(06-13-2018, 09:28 AM)Sw4Baggie Wrote: Now the dust has settled, what lessons do you hope the powers that be will have learned should we ever get back to the PL?

1. Learn how to sell players. Odemwingie, Berahino, Evans, it's all ended in tears; we need to learn when is the best time to cash in on players and reinvest.

2. Stay true to what's made you successful. Developing younger, hungry players was the cornerstone to our early success in the PL. We lost sight of this and focused on the short-term, which eventually caught up with us.

Re. this:

Evans is the only one that we should've got rid of immediately. He's typical of the worst aspects of a modern footballer. As soon as the going got tough, he displayed the spine of a jellyfish and couldn't wait to engineer his move away. Even going so far as to steal a taxi, probably in the hope we'd terminate his contract. We should've got rid as soon as the plane from Barcelona landed at Birmingham International Airport. 

The other two? With 20/20 hindsight, we should've got rid at the time, but at the time, we all supported Peace's stance on laughing at Spurs' derisory offer for Berahino and telling them to do one. Odemwingie was given the chance to reintegrate himself into the team, but he was more interested in Peter Odemwingie than the club that was paying his wages. Again though, at the time, we supported Peace in the light of twitchy 'Arry's blatant tapping up of the player.

Agree whilst we may have won the battle of principles, both incidents destabilised us and saw us take a big hit on what we could have earned for a player.

I'd argue our lack of experience in selling players makes us difficult for a buying club to gauge what we expect. Southampton for example have set a trend of getting top dollar for their sales and clubs rarely fuck them about with derisory bids. We were known to have an antagonist chairman in JP which whilst it saw us get good deals for players, probably hampered our ability to churn the squad a little.
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#13
The thing with Berahino though is that if the Spurs offer was contingent on a number of future milestones being passed we would quite likely have wound up with less than we got from Stoke.

I don't know if the exact structure of Levy's proposal ever became public.
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#14
Hindsight is a wonderful gift, we have made a few mistakes as have all sides, but the one big disappointment
for me has been how we have used the loan options, rarely getting much value at all. Last season was the worse
yet for loan signings, they cost big but delivered small.
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#15
Whoever Giuliano Terraneo recruits will be crucial of course. The club must invest to bring in the correct person, and not penny pinch here.
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#16
(06-13-2018, 11:17 AM)WilsonWoodhall Wrote: Whoever Giuliano Terraneo recruits will be crucial of course. The club must invest to bring in the correct person, and not penny pinch here.

Weve got nearly £100m worth of players we are able to sell so not sure where the resale thing comes in .... have more value in the squad than ever before 

Burnley already offered £25m for Rodriguez and Dawson (which isn’t enough) 
We’ll get £15m plus for Chadli and £16m for Rondon
£5m for McClean 
Hegazi worth £5m plus 
Gibbs £7m 
Philips £7m
Livermore £10m 

Yes, best part of £100m .... but no resale ???

In my opinion getting straight back up relies on keeping as many as possible 

Not to mention Evans could have been sold for circa £20m but all hindsight
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#17
(06-13-2018, 11:26 AM)Baggeridgebaggy Wrote:
(06-13-2018, 11:17 AM)WilsonWoodhall Wrote: Whoever Giuliano Terraneo recruits will be crucial of course. The club must invest to bring in the correct person, and not penny pinch here.

Weve got nearly £100m worth of players we are able to sell so not sure where the resale thing comes in .... have more value in the squad than ever before 

Burnley already offered £25m for Rodriguez and Dawson (which isn’t enough) 
We’ll get £15m plus for Chadli and £16m for Rondon
£5m for McClean 
Hegazi worth £5m plus 
Gibbs £7m 
Philips £7m
Livermore £10m 

Yes, best part of £100m .... but no resale ???

In my opinion getting straight back up relies on keeping as many as possible 

Not to mention Evans could have been sold for circa £20m but all hindsight

The resale issue only really hampered us in the PL. 

None of our players were good enough to step up to a club bigger/more successful than us, so we'd have only been selling to a club of an equivalent standing, who with similar wages and STCC challenges, would be unlikely to make an offer, which means our squad was able to go stale.

"Fortunately" we've been relegated at a time when our players are all 27-30, meaning they have a peak sale value... had we been relegated in say 2 years time we'd have struggled badly. The fact we're in the Champ, and our players have had to take a 50% pay cut means they become a more attractive proposition for PL clubs, but they'll want to pay lower fees due to their own STCC/value deflation challenges. 

If/When we are in the PL, we need to nurture and sell players to prevent the kind of squad stagnation that was setting in. We'd had the oldest squad in the PL for quite a while, and with our former manager being so reticent to buy/play younger players, we were a ticking timebomb!

PS: for me Livermore is worth a lot more than £10m. Vastly underrated is Jake, and just because he was underused by TP shouldn't reflect what we expect to get for him. Along with Dawson and JRod he's one I'd have on the DO NOT SELL list, unless the offer is outrageous. Lets not forget Leicester offered over £20m last summer.
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#18
Don't waste squad places on players who never play - if the coach doesn't like them, get rid.

Remind the coach that he works for the club - manipulating the market to line his own pockets is not acceptable.

Don't be afraid to challenge the coach on football matters. It's not rocket science - in general if what he's doing looks stupid, it is stupid.

Don't employ elderly players with nothing left to prove - this isn't a retirement home.

Make the coach understand that he has a duty to develop the young talent where possible.

Don't play players out of position.

Don't let the players run the club.
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#19
Don’t be happy to be a perfectly formed bonsai tree.
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#20
There's a lot of hindsight here, but the fact is, if we hadn't had two crooks for managers, playing for a pay-off, we'd still be in the Premier League. The six-match run under BD showed the results we were capable of and the league was utterly dire last season too. West Ham and Southampton fans must still be pinching themselves in disbelief at not being relegated.

All the points about recruitment, ambition, etc are true and led to our decline, but the relegation is firmly on the heads of TP and AP and those who employed them. The "We Lost Our Way" narrative is a convenient way of trying to hide that.
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