School Dinners
#11
(10-16-2020, 11:46 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:34 AM)Shabby Russian Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:30 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:24 AM)Borin' Baggie Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 09:32 AM)Protheroe Wrote: I'm not sure it's arrogant, selfish and downright cruel to expect parents to feed their kids during school holidays. On the contrary, I'd have considered it to be the minimum any parent should be able to do.

It is if those parents have lost their jobs or have long term income reductions through no fault of their own and the price of food hasn't reduced to account for this.

No, I rather think that's life. Food has rarely been cheaper nor more plentiful. The benefits system, foodbanks and charities already provide for those whose income has taken a hit.

Maybe the Trussell Trust could use some of the £62,000 + on costs it deems necessary to pay its new Diversity Director....

This is very typical of right wing thought.

Do a bit of whataboutery about the salary of a job you don't think should exist.

But 2 can play that game, so what about £7k a day paid to management consultants to (mis)manage the track and trace scheme. 

On the issue of school dinners - it is an interesting point raised . Why do the Govt think it is right to discontinue paying for lunches for children from disadvantaged backgrounds in school holidays, when they cover the cost in school terms.

I agree about the payments to consultants.

On the issue of school dinners in school holidays? Because when did it stop being a parent's reponsibility to feed their kids? TBH I can't believe this is even a debate.

(10-16-2020, 11:22 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Got to love the hypocrisy.

No hypocrisy at all. The state educates kids. Parents feed them.

When did the use of Foodbanks become acceptable in the UK?
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#12
(10-16-2020, 11:49 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:46 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:34 AM)Shabby Russian Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:30 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:24 AM)Borin' Baggie Wrote: It is if those parents have lost their jobs or have long term income reductions through no fault of their own and the price of food hasn't reduced to account for this.

No, I rather think that's life. Food has rarely been cheaper nor more plentiful. The benefits system, foodbanks and charities already provide for those whose income has taken a hit.

Maybe the Trussell Trust could use some of the £62,000 + on costs it deems necessary to pay its new Diversity Director....

This is very typical of right wing thought.

Do a bit of whataboutery about the salary of a job you don't think should exist.

But 2 can play that game, so what about £7k a day paid to management consultants to (mis)manage the track and trace scheme. 

On the issue of school dinners - it is an interesting point raised . Why do the Govt think it is right to discontinue paying for lunches for children from disadvantaged backgrounds in school holidays, when they cover the cost in school terms.

I agree about the payments to consultants.

On the issue of school dinners in school holidays? Because when did it stop being a parent's reponsibility to feed their kids? TBH I can't believe this is even a debate.

(10-16-2020, 11:22 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Got to love the hypocrisy.

No hypocrisy at all. The state educates kids. Parents feed them.

When did the use of Foodbanks become acceptable in the UK?

Never, but they certainly become a lot more prevalent sometime in 2010... which is strange.
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#13
(10-16-2020, 11:46 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:34 AM)Shabby Russian Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:30 AM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 10:24 AM)Borin' Baggie Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 09:32 AM)Protheroe Wrote: I'm not sure it's arrogant, selfish and downright cruel to expect parents to feed their kids during school holidays. On the contrary, I'd have considered it to be the minimum any parent should be able to do.

It is if those parents have lost their jobs or have long term income reductions through no fault of their own and the price of food hasn't reduced to account for this.

No, I rather think that's life. Food has rarely been cheaper nor more plentiful. The benefits system, foodbanks and charities already provide for those whose income has taken a hit.

Maybe the Trussell Trust could use some of the £62,000 + on costs it deems necessary to pay its new Diversity Director....

This is very typical of right wing thought.

Do a bit of whataboutery about the salary of a job you don't think should exist.

But 2 can play that game, so what about £7k a day paid to management consultants to (mis)manage the track and trace scheme. 

On the issue of school dinners - it is an interesting point raised . Why do the Govt think it is right to discontinue paying for lunches for children from disadvantaged backgrounds in school holidays, when they cover the cost in school terms.

I agree about the payments to consultants.

On the issue of school dinners in school holidays? Because when did it stop being a parent's reponsibility to feed their kids? TBH I can't believe this is even a debate.

(10-16-2020, 11:22 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: Got to love the hypocrisy.

No hypocrisy at all. The state educates kids. Parents feed them.

And if they can’t? When did the right care about the vulnerable during a decade of cuts to the services they relied on and when they were taken away resulted in foodbanks, a rise in violent youth crime etc? 

It’s right wing ideologically driven opportunism dresses up as concern.
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#14
(10-16-2020, 10:49 AM)Fido Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 09:09 AM)Ted Maul Wrote: This seems to have gone under the radar the last couple of days, alongside Marcus Rashford being awarded an MBE. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po...46208.html

Have this Government literally learnt nothing in the past seven months? Just when you think they can't make themselves any less popular they do this. Dominic Cummings unpaid council tax bill would have paid for around 25,000 school meals. Imagine voting for this bunch of arrogant, selfish and downright cruel bastards.

Our kids started off with 3-4 school meals a day and now they have one, max. All they seemed to be served is carbo-shite. Doesn't answer your question but this whole revolutionising of school meals in general has gone backwards.
I should have a word with your children's school. This is the current menu where I invigilate. There are two other snack outlets where sarnies and Baked pots can be purchased.


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#15
(10-16-2020, 11:49 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the use of Foodbanks become acceptable in the UK?

When did they become acceptable in Germany?

Whether you deem foodbanks to be acceptable or not they are a feature of most developed economies. Rather than bitching about their existence you ought to be celebrating the generosity of individuals' donations.

(10-16-2020, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the right care about the vulnerable

See this is why it's impossible to have a rational debate with you and any other committed leftist I've ever met.

I merely consider your beliefs to be misguided. You, however consider mine to be evil or malignant.

I think I probably care about the vulnerable just as much as you do. Where we differ is you prefer a hand out whereas I prefer a hand up. You'll never help the poor in the long run by merely subsidising their poverty, though you might get them to vote for you.
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#16
(10-16-2020, 01:30 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:49 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the use of Foodbanks become acceptable in the UK?

When did they become acceptable in Germany?

Whether you deem foodbanks to be acceptable or not they are a feature of most developed economies. Rather than bitching about their existence you ought to be celebrating the generosity of individuals' donations.

(10-16-2020, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the right care about the vulnerable

See this is why it's impossible to have a rational debate with you and any other committed leftist I've ever met.

I merely consider your beliefs to be misguided. You, however consider mine to be evil or malignant.

I think I probably care about the vulnerable just as much as you do. Where we differ is you prefer a hand out whereas I prefer a hand up. You'll never help the poor in the long run by merely subsidising their poverty, though you might get them to vote for you.

Hand outs when it suits Tories and their mates. Don't act like you give a fuck.

As for applauding people's generosity... it's not their responsibility to do the job of the state.
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#17
(10-16-2020, 01:30 PM)Protheroe Wrote:
(10-16-2020, 11:49 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the use of Foodbanks become acceptable in the UK?

When did they become acceptable in Germany?

Whether you deem foodbanks to be acceptable or not they are a feature of most developed economies. Rather than bitching about their existence you ought to be celebrating the generosity of individuals' donations.

(10-16-2020, 11:59 AM)Derek Hardballs Wrote: When did the right care about the vulnerable

See this is why it's impossible to have a rational debate with you and any other committed leftist I've ever met.

I merely consider your beliefs to be misguided. You, however consider mine to be evil or malignant.

I think I probably care about the vulnerable just as much as you do. Where we differ is you prefer a hand out whereas I prefer a hand up. You'll never help the poor in the long run by merely subsidising their poverty, though you might get them to vote for you.

What a load of nonsense...

Austerity did nothing to give people a hand up, it produced a gig economy where those at the bottom had little if any job security and continued the reliance on the state to top up their income. As for praising people for giving to food banks, it’s a very nice thing for someone to do but it shouldn’t be necessary.

You want people to believe the right give care and yet for a decade they went after the disabled, the poorest and weakest with cuts to services. At the same time they allowed huge corporations and wealthy individuals to pay as little tax as possible. As Big Ron used to say ‘don’t tell me, show me!’ The right have shown absolutely nothing to suggest they care about the most vulnerable on the contrary they have shown they believe them to be work shy, feckless and at all time’s should be met with suspicion.
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#18
Late stage capitalism does nothing for the vulnerable or unfortunate except further their exploitation. Wealth is more concentrated now than it has ever been in recent history and trickle down economics has been proven over and over again to be total bollocks.

If a disabled person is unable to work to sustain themselves, in what way is cutting their benefits and access to necessary services giving them a 'hand up'. Especially when large corporations and Tory donors get to swim in public cash. The Tory raison d'etre is to keep the rich rich and the poor poor. You might say it isn't but the all the evidence of the past century is against you.

"You, however consider mine to be evil or malignant" - I absolutely, absolutely do. Instead of rolling your eyes at the question, "when did the right care about the vulnerable" why don't you actually have a go at answering it?
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#19
(10-16-2020, 04:29 PM)ChamonixBaggie Wrote: Late stage capitalism does nothing for the vulnerable or unfortunate except further their exploitation. Wealth is more concentrated now than it has ever been and trickle down economics has been proven over and over again to be total bollocks.

If a disabled person is unable to work to sustain themselves, in what way is cutting their benefits and access to necessary services giving them a 'hand up'. Especially when large corporations and Tory donors get to swim in public cash. The Tory raison d'etre is to keep the rich rich and the poor poor. You might say it isn't but the all the evidence of the past century is against you.

"You, however consider mine to be evil or malignant" - I absolutely, absolutely do. Instead of rolling your eyes at the question, "when did the right care about the vulnerable" why don't you actually have a go at answering it?

"Capitalism" is the reason we have the Welfare State and the NHS.

To conflate capitalism with Tory cronyism is absurd.
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#20
(10-17-2020, 10:16 PM)billybassett Wrote: Happy to be persuaded. Here's the starting analysis I used moved on. A couple of months

https://hectordrummond.com/2020/07/10/ri...-covid-19/

Thanks for that BB and I will look in detail at it when I have a few more minutes and using % of population is a reasonable approach (which I thought it would be) however there is one major flaw to the point made in all that is that it is being compared with winter / springs of each year when we have only had a spring so far (this winter will be the 1st with covid) so I am going to say that, at best, it is too early to say this is a good measure. I will try and work out the same figures with population built in but I suspect strongly that this argument will disappear when we add in the winter coming.
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